Monday, June 11, 2007

Monday 06/11 A.M. Quickie:
Sopranos, Spurs, Pujols, F1 Mania, More!

So: What did you think of the Sopranos finale last night? As unsettling as the ending was (I won't put a spoiler, but if you haven't watched it by now, I likely won't be the cause of your spoiler-type problems), I like it better than the alternative of definitiveness. My favorite TV critic, Tom Shales, called it "ingenious," and I agree.

NBA Finals: Spurs go up 2-0 on the Cavs. I should say "Finalzzz." If the NBA had a Finals and nobody bothered to watch, does it make a sound? The Cavs are so overmatched, it's not funny... or pretty... or interesting... or anything.

The Cavs' one chance to make this anything but a done-deal is to sweep the three games in Cleveland. And they're not doing that. No one can convince me that the Spurs winning in 6 (let alone 5 or 4) is interesting.

Tony Parker: 30 points. I know he gets to play with Duncan, but wow, do you think he is serving as the template for "super-fast, scoring point guard" as a must-have for any contender?

MLB Stud: It's been an unusually quiet season for Albert Pujols on the "Stud" watch, but he makes it this morning with a 2-HR game yesterday. (A-Rod had one, too.)

NBA Rumor of the Moment: Celtics shipping No. 5 pick to Suns for Shawn Marion? It's a win-win.

If the Celtics want to win now, they need to make this move. And, let's be honest: In the "win now" context, Marion is better (if older and more expensive) than any player in this draft, perhaps except Oden and Durant. Boston needs the player with the 5-pick less than they need Marion to team with Pierce and Jefferson as the best frontcourt in the East. Yes, you read that correctly.

For the Suns, they will miss Marion's all-around game, but – honestly – they can't afford him financially. And if they can plug his role via the draft with one of the three Florida guys (Horford, Noah or Brewer: They all fit in their own way), it's not all that painful.

Arenas Watch: OK, so maybe I overreacted about Gilbert opting out of his Wizards deal after next season. But he's just so unpredictable, I don't like even the possibility he'd leave, even though I'm pretty sure the Wizards will lock him up with the biggest deal possible.

Tennis: Nadal shuts down Federer (again). Roger will simply have to concede that his all-time-best career happens to coincide with the career of the greatest player ever on clay. It's like having four criteria for "greatest baseball pitcher" and "how you throw a knuckleball" is one of those criteria.

NASCAR: Looks like Jeff Gordon is back.

F1: Hamiltonian greatness. Every "niche" sport needs a poster athlete, from Tiger (PGA) to Sharapova (WTA) to Danica (IRL) to Beckham (MLS). F1 needed a superstar to break through with an American audience (to the extent it even can): Lewis Hamilton is that guy.

TV Gimmicks: ESPN is launching a "Who's Now" segment on SportsCenter that will seed 32 active athletes into a bracket and have viewers vote on who is the ultimate athlete.

OK: As a veteran architect or consultant on plenty of brackets in my career, let me save everyone the trouble: Tiger Woods is going to win.

In case you missed it, I spent the weekend guest-blogging at Deadspin for the vacationing MJD. I'm still recovering.

-- D.S.


Matt T said...

That was an interesting Sunday night game last night.

Throwing out Lilly was ridiculous (and I'm a Braves fan).

Renteria said in the paper today that he took exception to it being near his head, if he'd hit him in the back or ass he wouldn't have cared.

pv845 said...

For the love of all Dan, no one wants anyone from UF except maybe Brewer. They are going to become the next Duke. Good in college, suck in the NBA.

Honorary Stud: Royals bats, 17 runs, where did this come from?

Mikepcfl said...

I used to think I was an NBA fan, but these finals are barely registering with me more than the NHL finals did. And that's not at all. I just cant find a reason to watch even a minute so far.

How many more viewers do you think watched the Sopranos compared to the Spurs/Cavs? I say the Sopranos tripled the NBA game in viewers.

CMFost said...

DUD - The Soprano's and Writer David Chase: WORST. EPISODE. EVER.

It was horrible not just the ending but the entire show. That was more like an episode you would have in the middle of the season not as the series finale. There was too many new story lines, too many loose ends not tied up. And the ending left me saying "What the FUCK??? that's it"

I tell you if they are setting up for a movie then they lost my $10. From what was at one point the best show on TV it went downhill fast from about season 3 on and then to end like that was just plain dumb.

TBender said...

The Lilly incident ties right into the discussion from last week, no?

The Ump "knew" he did it on purpose. Thank you MLB for empowering the umpires with ESP.

CMFost said...

Mike after watching the Soprano's I was wishing I watched the NBA game. And considering how bad the ratings for a Game #1 was I think the NBA is kicking itself for having game #2 go against the Soprano's

Geoff said...

Washington would be crazy to throw a max contract at Arenas. The guy is a good player at all but he is a chucker and it is really hard to build a championship team around a player that defines "Me-First".

Thank god for Nadal, if not for him there would be absolutely nothing interesting in mens tennis at the moment. Not that Federer climbing towards "Greatest Ever" isn't interesting (he ain't there yet), but it would be so boring if he had no one who could even give him a fight.

Matt said...

bad bad night last night for me last night. 1st i watch my cavs get fisted again and then my favorite show all time ends like a bitch. i couldnt believe it ended. there were so many other ways to go and they just end it with them at dinner and the door opens.

fuck that!! i wanted to see something anything! but we got more uncle june...some more bs and screen

i thought my tivo messed up and i missed the ending.

worst. night. ever.

Matt said...

oh and journey was playing!!!!!!!!
ahhhhh can someone please remove their foot from my balls this morning

Mikepcfl said...

cmfost, you're right, the NBA should be kicking itself not just for scheduling Game 2 against the Sopranos finale, but for spacing so many days between games. Come on, Game 1 was on Thursday and it's not like they had to travel. They tried to build ratings and I think it will bite them hard big time. When you combine the delay between games, the lack of any drama for the series and then the Sopranos finale, you will have a record low game 2.

Unknown said...

I agree. I completely stopped watching the Sopranos and felt no reason to pay for HBO. The quality of the writing in the Sopranos went downhill fast to the extent I had no interest anymore.

Lilly getting thrown out was insane. Interesting that they had the mic on the ump. What a moronic explanation. He knew it was going to happen. Renferia should be suspended for throwing the elbow going into 2nd base. That was intentional.

Yanks are on a roll. The big question is if they can keep it going. Only 5.5 out of the WC race. The Mets did them no favors by losing to Detroit who leads the wild card.

I had the NBA finals on in the background last night. The reason I wanted to see Detroit - SA is that it would have been more competitive. You realize how bad a team Cleveland is when LeBron sits on the bench.

Duncan 4 time NBA finals MVP? Or will Parker get it? That is about the only suspense left.

CMFost said...

Cycledan let's not get to excited about the Yankees run. they won 6 straight against teams that they should beat. Let's see what happens this week when they play 2 good team in Arizona and the Mets.

CMFost said...

So far my prediction of the Spurs winning in 4 and winning every game by 8 or more points is looking good.

jhawkjjm said...

I never watched the Sopranos before (just got HBO about a year ago so missed the entire first x season) but I decided to watch last night to see how it ended. I only had one thought afterwards: "This is supposed to be one of the top shows?"

And upon flicking and seeing the Spurs up 25 in the 2nd quarter made me keep on going. It wasn't even close enough so people would tune in after the Sopranos ended.

AL continues to win big in interleague play, I think I heard they won 51 of 84 or something like that.

Andy said...

As a Cubs fan, the Lilly ejection is completely ludicrious. Look at the situation. 1st inning. 2 outs. Nobody on base. Why in the world would you want to hit somebody?? There's no possible reason. It was just an inside pitch that went a little too inside. It does suck that it was near the head, but Soriano would have gotten nailed in the head on Saturday had he not stood up a little. Plus, it's Ted Lilly. He's not the guy you expect to do that. He's pretty low key. It was bulls***.

JCrow said...

The way the Yankees season has been going, a 6 game win streak is something to get excited about no matter who they beat. Funny how they started winning the last 2 years once Cabrera was inserted into the starting lineup.

I thought the Sopranos ending was good. Left you with something to think about and talk about instead just some pathetic ending like most other shows give you. It was also kind of fun hearing screams throughout the neighborhood as the tv's went black.

Unknown said...

Not too excited about the Yanks. I realize that they just played the Pirates but as a fan I still feel better about winning 9 out of 11.

The AL simply has better teams and players now than the NL. It goes in cycles. I remember hearing people saying the same things about the AL that they now say about the NL. Same in the NFL. For a while the top few teams were in the NFC. Now they are in the AFC. In few years it will reverse itself again.

ToddTheJackass said...

Yesterday's MLB Studs and Duds:

1. A-Rod - 2/3, 2HR, 5RBI, 4R, 2BB
2. Albert Pujols - 2/3, 2HR, 5RBI, 2R, BB
3. CC Sabathia - 9IP, 0ER, 3H, BB, 6Ks (ND)
4. Jason Hirsh - W, 9IP, 1ER, 5H, BB, 2K
5. Brandon Inge - 3/4, HR, 5RBI

1. Tom Glavine - L, 4.1IP, 9ER, 11H, 2BB
2. Ryan Dempster - L, 1IP, 3ER, 3H, 3BB
3. Shawn Chacon - L, 3.1IP 7ER, 8H, 3BB
4. Mike Timlin - 1IP, 3R, H, BB, 2R-Error
5. Tyler Clippard - 3.2IP, 6ER, 6H, 3BB

Honorary Dud: The Ump who threw out Lilly... wow.

chipp said...

Jeff Weaver had a better weekend than Jerod Weaver!

Nadal is NOT the "greatest ever" on clay: Borg won 6 or 7 French Opens and retired at age 25. Nadal is really good, but Federererererer did beat him on clay a few weeks ago.

CMFost said...

Going into the Sports world if the Celtics can make the trade and only give up the #5 pick for Marion they should get it done. It might be the best you can do with out hurting your current roster.

ToddTheJackass said...

Wow, I'm fairly certain that Julian Tavarez is some sort of alien (and not just because he seems to understand Manny). This was written in the Globe today:

Tavarez revealed he has been pitching with a blister on the middle finger of his pitching hand. "[Josh ] Beckett would be on the DL with this," Tavarez said, showing the blister. Tavarez said he pops the blister and dries it out by rubbing in some Red Bull and ground-up aspirin.

Y-Town Pride said...

David Chase didn't give in to what we wanted to see - good for him. Too many times shows "jump the shark" because that is what viewers want.

We watched the show for years from the vantage point of others surrounding Tony. The show ended seeing the world through Tony's eyes. Judging, worrying, aprehension, is this my last meal? Believe it or not, he leads a boring life like all of us and Chase reminded us of that.

Greenie said it best this morning: "Jerry Seinfeld goes to jail in his last episode, but Tony Soprano does not"

Y-Town Pride said...

A boring life with a few exceptions of hunted and being hunted.

J Fitty said...

"Looks like Jeff Gordon is back"???

Jeff Gordon has been back! At least this season. 4th win in the last 7 races (and 4th this season). Hopefull he can keep it up when he moves to "Varsity Dad" status in the next month!

CMFost said...

Y-Town the Soprano's jumped the Shark sometime during Season 3. really if you think about the last great episode of the Soprano's was probably the Pine Barrens one when Pauly and Christopher were chasing the Russian through the woods

ToddTheJackass said...

So what's the ETA on the Sopranos movie? I mean, all having the show ending like that means is that they HAVE to do a few movies, right?

Yankees are playing well right now, though playing the Pirates at home still helps. I got to thinking last night though if Giambi's absence from the team might actually be addition by subtraction? Right now it sure looks like it, doesn't it?

Unknown said...

I completely agree that the Sopranos was never the same after that whole Russian incident. When interviewed about not resolving the Russian incident when Paulie and Christopher were stranded in the woods was awful. Chase sounded indignant and annoyed when people asked him about it. You can't leave a guy running through the woods after they tried to kill him and then not talk about the result, implications between Tony and the Russian mob or anything.

The point of good writing is to develop characters, build up relations and show how it comes to some sort of climax. To build up a major plot point, not resolve it and simply let it drop is crap. At least have a flash of a newreport where he was found dead in the woods. Anything. That is not genius at not resolving it, it is laziness.

Unknown said...

Simmons always talked about his Ewing effect where a team may be better without some superstar. In this case, Giambi is not such a superstar. With Cabrerra in center and Damon DHing, Yanks seem to be more rounded defensively.

The key to me really is that players like Cano and Abreu are starting to hit.

verbal97 said...

Soprano's was a downer. The only people that would like it are Arts majors (creative writing, english lit, theater, psychology) who would think that the ending was interesting or genious (ahem, Dan, ahem). Personally, I'm with cycledan, the writing was lazy and the ending was a complete cop-out.

futurelegendvinceyoung said...

Chase has stated that if he makes a Sopranos movie that it is going to detail Tony's ancestors. I liked the ending and the episode. Like most Sopranos seasons the penultimate episode had all of the drama and action and the finale was slower with one exception (Phil Leotardo's death). I read that Meadow walks into the restaurant in the west coast version and then the screen fades to black.

It seems like a lot of critics and fans are upset with how it ended but I like that they did not have the "Hollywood" ending.

Mega said...

MLB Stud- Mark Buerhle finally notching his 100th win.

MLB Dud- anyone pissing, moaning, whining, and crying about the Lilly ejection. The ump knew the retaliation was coming and Lilly's beaning was obviously intentional.

Unknown said...

The ratings for the championship games of MLB, NBA, and NHL have been pretty weak as of late; the NFL is the only one consistently having strong ratings because it is one game and done. Seven series formats are just not holding fans attentions anymore.

chipp said...

Great point Kev. Same goes for CFL. College, not Canadian.

Richard K. said...

I was watchign The Sopranos with 3 of my friends, and we gave it more credit than it deserved.

We thought Comcast was such a piece of shit that the cable went out for a few seconds during the finale.

Then I watched it on DirecTV at 12:00 to find out that it was the actual ending. Never been more dissappointed in an episode of any show....ever. And that includes season 3 of Entourage.

verbal97 said...

Here's a question for the peanut gallery? Which show finale was the best ever, and which was the worst ever?

CMFost said...

I would vote for the Soprano's being the Worst Ever. And the final episode of Seinfeld being 2nd Worst.

CMFost said...

Richard K - Season 3 of Entourage is not over yet and it has been a pretty good season. Season 3 returns with new episodes next week.

PatriotsNation said...

M*A*S*H - Best ever finale with Newhart a close 2nd.
Seinfeld - worst ever easily!

ToddTheJackass said...

Best series finale ever: M*A*S*H

Worst series finale ever: Newhart

PatriotsNation said...

Todd-Newhart has been voted best ever finale numerous times!!
Underrated Finale - St. Elsewhere - that was a great show and The Wonder Years as well, Winnie Cooper bb!!!

ToddTheJackass said...

X-Files was another horrific series ending... but that show had jumped the shark for a while there.

ToddTheJackass said...

I know J, the Newhart episode is always so highly-regarded, I just hate the "it was all a dream" bit for anything. But yeah, I'm sure there are other ones that are worse.

Mikepcfl said...

My favorite final episode of any series was Star Trek: The Next Generation. It was a brilliant idea and showed off Patrick Stewart's incredible acting ability. And the final scene at the poker table was actually touching.

Also enjoyed: Magnum PI, Cheers and Frasier's last episode.

R. Crowe said...

I can't believe how many GREAT things happened in last night's episode. Sopranos was almost NEVER satisfying, so why should the finale offer closure?

Top 8 things in last night's finale:

8. The cat.
7. AJ destroying his car
6. "Socially Conscious" AJ becoming a movie exec and picking up his teenage girlfriend at the high school in his new car.
5. The look on Tony's face as Meadow describes her career choice in law, sticking up for wrongly persecuted Italian Americans like her father.
4. The FBI agent blurting out "We're gonna win this thing!" when he hears of Phil's demise.
3. Phil's demise.
2. Somehow, David Chase made "Don't Stop Believing" relevant and goose-bump inducing again.
1. The look on Carmela's face as Tony re-hashes his "mother issues" to AJ's therapist.

Bayma said...

MLB Dud -- Jim Wolf, the umpire who threw out Ted Lilly. Looks like someone had Frosted Douchebags for breakfast.

marcomarco said...

@ Sopranos

A movie at this point would suck. The only interesting ppl left are Tony and Pauly.

Chase is a smug prick, and will be labelled 'brilliant' for the simple fact that he's consistently spat in the faces of his loyal following, yet they (we) still follow.

He's laughing his way to the bank, because everyone and their mother is talking about it today. 50-50 split between those who loved it and those who think it sucked.

Those same 50-50 can be similarly divided between Starbucks (yuppie, "I value the artistic statement") and Dunkin Donuts (blue collar, "I need closure").

Dan, you must go to starbucks.

The 50% of pissed off fans will get over it when the DVD is released with the other two alternate endings.

I cancelled my HBO subscription at 10:04 EST, as soon as i stopped swearing.

The heroin sheik said...

I have never seen more than 5 minutes of any episode of the sopranos. I feel so alone. Then again HBO only ever made one show I liked, Band of Brothers. I was always partial to the finales of Frazier, Newhart, and the A-Team.

Early stud for tomorrow: the judge who threw out Genarlow Wilson's sentence.

Kurt said...

"CMFost said...
Cycledan let's not get to excited about the Yankees run. they won 6 straight against teams that they should beat. Let's see what happens this week when they play 2 good team in Arizona and the Mets."

The Yankees take 2 of 3 from the Red Sox, what do you say: "they should have taken all 3, lets see if they keep it up. The Yankees proceed to win 9 of 11, what do you say "they should win those games". If not for a lucky Pedroia strikeout-single and a botched Tony Clark double play, your so-called "insurmountable" 14.5 game lead would be 8.5.

CMFost said...

Kurt let's see what happens this week when the Yankees actually play 2 good teams. If they take 5 of 6 against the D-backs and Mets I will worry but when they lose 5 of 6 and the Red Sox are back to a double digit lead there will be no worries. The Yankees swept the Pirates at home big deal.

CMFost said...

One of the best finales of a show ever and probably the best closing sequence in the history of TV was the finale of "Six feet under"

ToddTheJackass said...

The Yankees had a great week, even if it wasn't against good teams. They did what they needed to do, and up until this point they hadn't done that. So if anything, the Yankees showed us this past week that they are still very much alive, though I'd still say their taking the division is unlikely (Wild Card battle could be insane this year).

Their offense looks better, but really I think they only faced one good pitcher (Gorzelanny), and a lot of bad ones (Chacon, Maholm, Vazquez, Buerhle). Contreras could go either way, though I think most of us would agree that he's a pitcher that most good lineups would be expected to beat, correct?

Yankees fans should be pleased (especially with Abreu and Cano's resurgence), but I think should also be cautious of making any claims that they're completely back in the division race yet. Don't forget that the Red Sox still have all of their games left against Tampa.

TJ said...

@ heroin sheik. I second that. About freakin' time. Hurray to that judge.

@pv845. I find it interesting, then, that Corey Brewer will be the second Gator selected in the draft.

@andy. As a Cubs fan, I absolutely thought when it happened that Lilly was throwing at him. It was the first inning, no one on, 2 outs, and the day before two Cubs were plunked. Perfect situation to retaliate with minimal risk to the outcome of the game. That being said, there's no way the ump should have tossed him for that, not after the day before. And I thought the ump's "I know he was throwing at him. I knew it would happen and was waiting for it" comments to Lou were a little weird.

Unknown said...

Good call on Star Trek the Next Generation. Great finale. It didn't make the mistake of trying to do too much or too little. It brought all the characters together, did a little nostalgic trip back but worked it into a great plot. The key was it was just another episode in many ways which is what brought fans to the show to begin with.

pv845 said...

If ST:TNG was the best, which it was pretty darn good, then ST:Enterprise was the worst.

@ Troy, great, so he is the second Gator picked. Magic really seem to be enjoying that second Dukie picked of Reddick. Not to mention that Williams sucks in the NBA as well for the Hawks.

JCrow said...

Buerhle's a bad pitcher? Hmmm....his numbers look pretty good to me. The wins suck, but it's hard to get wins when you have about 4 guys in your lineup hovering around the .200 mark. Even Vazquez really isn't that bad.

TJ said...

@pv. My point was: people want them. Whether you think they'll be good pros or not, Gator players are, by definition, thought pretty highly of when 3 should go lottery and the 6th man might get picked late second round. I have my own doubts about their future (I think how well they played as a team made up for some pretty glaring individual weaknesses) but Gators, come draft day, are definitely going to go early and often. Sorry.

pv845 said...

@ Troy, I apologize then. I misunderstood your point. I completely agree with what you are saying.

They are highly regarded, but I think Brewer and Horford can be serviceable NBA players to above average. Noah will be abused by real post players in the NBA.

I guess we will see.

ToddTheJackass said...

Admittedly, I haven't watched Buerhle pitch this year, so I could be wrong.

But while his numbers do look pretty good (especially his WHIP), I'm a little skeptical since really he hasn't faced many great lineups. He hasn't faced Detroit, Boston, or even Seattle, has only 1.1 IP against the Indians, and got hit pretty hard against the Yankees and D-Rays.

So maybe he's not a "bad" pitcher, as I suggested earlier, but I really don't think he's even close to a great pitcher any more, or more than a 3 starter on most staffs.

Kevin said...

How about greatest athlete of all-time? Here's my top 3: Jackie Robinson, Bo Jackson, Pele. Am I way off-base on this one?

Buerhle doesn't miss enough bats to be a great pitcher, btw. He's a solid #3, possibly a mediocre #2, but no longer anything close to an ace. Of course, there are plenty of teams who could use a solid #3 starter...

futurelegendvinceyoung said...


Entourage Season 4 starts next week. The boys going down to Columbia with Billy Walsh was the Season 3 finale.

CMFost said...

Can it really be considered a new season when it was only off for what a week? I know they said it was a season finale but come on. That was like the finale of season 3.0 and this is now the continuation of that season

The Poobah said...

I think with the Sopranos, Chase wanted us to see what it's like to be in Tony's shoes. Every person he sees is a possible threat. And it never stops for him. The first 1/2 hour storylines got hammered out -- Phil gets killed, peace with NY, last visit with Junior, etc... Thought it was pretty interesting. Good or bad I don't know. I do know that I thought my cable went out at the end.

It's just funny that there are two strong camps -- one who love Sopranos and think that it's some work of art or something, and another group who want it to be like Goodfellas or any other mob story and just have people get whacked all the time. The first group loved the last episode and the second group hated it.

And I also think that Pine Barrens episode was the most overrated ever. Some things just happen in a vacuum and there's no resolution. Deal with it.

The Legend of Vincent Tremblay said...

Braves/Cubs: That ump should be suspended. How can you call a fair game when you decide back in the hotel room to eject the first Cubs pitcher who throws a high, tight fastball?

Permanent Dud: The entire Pirates organization, from the ownership down, from now until they are sold to somebody willing to narrow their profit margin long enough to win.

NASCAR: Jeff Gordon is back?! More like Jeff Gordon has an angel on his shoulder. That yellow flag came out at just the perfect time to protect him from getting passed by Ryan Newman.

Sopranos: Family. Paranoia. The fear that it could all end in an instant. The mundaneness of Tony's life, distilled into a single scene.

I'll take that over a Seinfeldian nicely wrapped package of crap any day.

Series Finales: Babylon 5.

Richard K. said...


Season 3 was a dud compared to season 2. Although it's still one of the best shows on TV right now.

Jen said...

I thought something happened to our cable at the end of The Sopranos too! I can't decide if I liked the end or not. I was just waiting for something to happen. I did like the added "stress" Meadow added to it.

I loved the Six Feet Under finale. That is probably one of my favorites. I can't even REMEMBER the Cheers finale so I'll go with "it was great" ha
The Seinfeld finale was the worst in history.

{SIGH} I have no comment on the Cavs.

Major duds: The Indians. Can't even score a run to support another outstanding performance by C.C., let alone win a series against the stinky Reds. Give me a Napoleon Dynamite "Geeeeez"

Jen said...

or is that "Goooosh"??

pv845 said...

I think the Seinfeld finale was weird, but not the worst ever. Putting the show in perspective if you watched the whole series, I think that it fit in two ways. 1) everyone came back to haunt them for them being themselves and 2) it followed in the same vein as the show and was not typical and they were arrested for doing nothing about nothing.

ToddTheJackass said...

Also in the Seinfeld finale there was something kind of cool to bringing back a lot of the bit characters that made the show great. I hated it at the time, but I think it makes a lot of sense looking back on it.

Mega said...

Its funny how the Cubs fans/East Coasters who watch nothing more than ESPN think that Buerhle is a bad pitcher. Whats even funnier is that unlike some of these other so-called "good" pitchers that they mention, he is the ONLY one this season so far with a no hitter. That includes anyone on any Boston or Yankee staff.

Mega said...

Oh and if anyone wants to argue that Mark B isn't a great pitcher because he doesn't "miss enough bats"...two words for you:

Greg Maddux.


futurelegendvinceyoung said...

Fost, I get what you are saying but I think the reason they had such a quick turn around for Entourage is the storyline. Season 4 we get to see how the boys handle themselves when there butts are on the line because they are financing the picture. As we have seen with Vinnie it will all turn out all right and we get more Billy Walsh which is great. I think if Billy Walsh were real he would love to call Dan a suit.

ToddTheJackass said...

Dan Mega, I believe it's you who needs to take off the homerism-glasses.

I can't imagine you'd hear anyone on this blog talking about great Yankees pitching... (Pettite is having a good year though). And surely you wouldn't argue that Buerhle is better than Beckett.

And are you seriously comparing Mark Buerhle to Greg Maddux? Maddux is a once in a lifetime type pitcher, and a Hall of Famer. Maddux also has 5 seasons where he struck out 190 or more, (so it's not like he always never missed a ton of bats). So you're completely wrong to say that Buerhle compares to Maddux in that regard (unless you're comparing the last few years, which are far from Maddux's prime).

Also, no-hitters are kind of neat, but in the grand scale of pitching greatness, do they actually mean much? Not really...

Bobo Holloman, Wilson Alvarez, and Bumpus Jones have thrown no-hitters. Roger Clemens, Greg Maddux, Steve Carlton, John Smoltz, Ferguson Jenkins, and a lot more Hall of Famers never threw no-hitters.

And while you were quick to criticize our East Coast Bias, you didn't address any of the points I made. So I'll ask again, what good team has he pitched well against?

But if us East Coasters are so blind, what is Buerhle doing this year that he hasn't in years past that he's on pace for a career low in BAA or BABIP?

Mega said...

Kevin said Buerhle doesn't "miss enough bats" to be a great pitcher, and my refute to that point is Greg Maddux. So you can continue to put words in my mouth like "compare", but it doesn't change the fact that Buerhle is a good pitcher like some here would like to argue.

He has pitched well against:

And you're right, he hasn't pitched against any other good teams so far. Its not his fault the AL Least sucks. Its not my fault you haven't watched the games to realize that a ton of the runs that have gotten in have been the results of some terrible D by the ChiSox.

Kevin said...

Kevin said Buerhle doesn't "miss enough bats" to be a great pitcher, and my refute to that point is Greg Maddux.

Maddux career K/9: 6.16
Buerhle career K/9: 5.25

Out of pitchers last year with over 100 IP, 6.16 K/9 would have been good for 66th (middle-of-the-pack), while 5.25 would have 100th (near the bottom). It's a noticable difference. Plus, Maddux in his prime - back when he was an ace - had an even higher number - his career avg. seems low b/c four of the last five years he's been under 5.5. Buerhle's still in his prime, and should still have his best stuff.

ToddTheJackass said...

If pitching well TWICE against the Angels means he gave up 3 ER in 6.0IP each time, that's not a lot to hang your argument on, is it? The 8K performance maybe, but he still gave up 9H and 2HR in that outing.