Thursday, November 01, 2007

Thursday 11/01 A.M. Quickie:
Durant, Mavs, Bush, Hot Stove, More!

Today's Names to Know: Kevin Durant, LeBron James, Rashard Lewis, Reggie Bush, Al Jefferson, Torii Hunter, John Beck, Jon Kitna and More!

Two huge games this weekend in the NFL and college football -- arguably the biggest regular-season games in each sport of this season: Pats-Colts and Arizona State-Oregon. Complete coverage coming tomorrow.

I know a lot of you don't care very much about the NBA. My focus on game results probably won't continue beyond tonight, when I'll go with a more MLB-style "Studs" and "Duds" each morning.

Kevin Durant's NBA debut: 18 points, which is respectable, but it took him 7/22 FG shooting to get there. (He added 5 rebounds, 3 steals and a block.)

More notably, he was the third-leading scorer on his team, which might foreshadow that with a focus on Durant, he'll make his teammates better. Delonte West (19 pts, 5 ast) seems like a beneficiary. By the way, the Sonics are going to be terrible. The Suns, playing with fresh legs, are going to destroy them tonight in PHX's season debut.

(By the way, Carmelo and Iverson combined for 57 points and Camby had 15 rebounds and 5 blocks; if that's the way it's going to be this season, the Nuggets will be a solid contender.)

The Mavs routed the Cavs, but can anyone take the Mavs' regular-season success seriously anymore? I'm tempted not to talk about them until they reach the second-round of the playoffs.

(Meanwhile, LeBron was terrible: 10 points on 2/11 FG shooting, with as many turnovers as assists. Rough start for many experts' MVP.)

Rashard Lewis is a great fit in Orlando: Lewis had a game-high 26 and the Magic crushed the Bucks, flashing a new-look 3-point-shot-heavy offense. Hey, whatever works...

The Hornets start strong, with a win over the Kings (Chris Paul: 22 and 12 assists). Still a feel-good story, particularly with the NBA All-Star Game in New Orleans this season...

The Wizards are off to a slow start if they are going to have the best record in the East as I said they would. (Arenas had 34 though, including a buzzer-beating 3 to send the game to OT...)

It's closing in on Reggie Bush: The skeevy marketer he worked with is going to give the NCAA what sounds like conclusive proof that Bush himself was paid during the 2005 season. Even the NCAA can't bungle this one.

That means: There's a good chance the NCAA will turn all of USC's wins into "L's" (though they can't take away Texas' brilliant win in the Rose Bowl). It remains to be seen whether the Heisman group feels pressure to take back their trophy. I'm not quite sure fans would have a problem if they stripped it from Bush and gave it to the runner-up, Vince Young, who ultimately proved more worthy of the award.

(The real intrigue is whether any of this bleeds into 2004, when the NCAA would actually face the idea of stripping the national championship from USC.)

Meanwhile, there's still the whole idea of a punishment for the top-tier Trojans program. The ultimate penalty in this day and age would be not allowing them to play on TV for a season.

More NBA: The T'wolves gave new franchise cornerstone Al Jefferson a huge contract extension. (Of those who did NOT get an extension: Luol Deng, Ben Gordon, Emeka Okafor, Andre Iguodala.)

MLB Hot Stove Pre-Heat: Torii Hunter will meet with the White Sox next week.

Meanwhile, the biggest value yet from Curt Schilling's "inside-baseball" blog came out: He listed the 12 teams he would be interested in signing with. (The Yankees were notably missing.)

The new A-Rod storyline is that he could very well return to the Yankees, which totally makes sense if you understand that Scott Boras wants to maximize the size of his clients' contract and that the Yankees, still, are the market-makers for contract size.

(Or perhaps it should be phrased that A-Rod could very well return to New York... with the Mets. GM Omar Minaya said he would talk with David Wright about how he would feel about a position change. Hmm... the Mets are one of the few teams that could afford A-Rod.)

Oh, and where's the World Series ball? Because Jason Varitek doesn't have it.

NFL: I don't feel like adding to the Pats-Colts build-up (until tomorrow, when I will pick the Pats to win by 30). In other NFL news, is it John Beck time in Miami? I'm sure Dolphins fans hope so.

Meanwhile, Jeff George may be interested in the Vikings, but the feeling isn't mutual. (And why should it be? The guy hasn't played since the turn of the century.)

Oh, and I think that Jon Kitna is infinitely more likeable and cool for having dressed up as a naked guy at a fast-food drive-through, like the team's assistant coach Joe Cullen.

Finally, Pac-Man Jones' lawyer says he'll apply for reinstatement after the Titans' 10th game in mid-November. Good luck with that.

College Hoops: A 5-8, 125-pound 14-year-old combo guard from Las Vegas verbally committed to Rutgers. Seriously: REALLY? Meanwhile, exhibition seasons are heating up. Two-time defending champ Florida takes on Flagler tonight.

Thursday Night College Football: Virginia Tech vs. Georgia Tech? Meh. VT lost their relevancy when they lost that lead a week ago tonight.

CFB Top 25: Here's this week's BlogPoll analysis from Brian Cook. (h/t Fanhouse)

-- D.S.

165 comments:

pv845 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
pv845 said...

I hope that A-Rod's action on Sunday take a huge chunk out of his new contract.

There are going to be a lot of good games on TV this weekend.

GuyInTheCorner said...

STUDS
1. Chris Paul - 7/13 FG, 7/8 FT, 8 REB, 12 AST, 3 STL, 22 PTS
2. Manu Ginobili - 6/14 FG, 5/9 3PT, 13/14 FT, 5 REB, 7 AST, 2 STL, 1 BLK, 30 PTS
3. Richard Jefferson - 7/15 FG, 3/4 3PT, 12/12 FT, 10 REB, 2 AST, 2 BLK, 29 PTS
4. Allen Iverson - 9/22 FG, 7/9 FT, 5 REB, 14 AST, 7 STL, 25 PTS
5. Carmelo Anthony - 10/21 FG, 3/6 3PT, 9/10 FT, 5 REB, 5 AST, 32 PTS

Honorary Stud: Gilbert Arenas -
Buzzer-beating 3PT to send game to OT.
DUDS
1. Charlie Villanueva - 1/8 FG, 0/2 3PT, 6 REB, 1 AST, 3 TO, 2 PTS, 19 MIN
2. LeBron James - 2/11 FG, 0/2 3PT, 6/10 FT, 5 REB, 4 AST, 1 STL, 5 TO, 10 PTS, 36 MIN
3. Maurice Williams - 4/15 FG, 3 REB, 1 AST, 9 PTS, 34 MIN
4. Michael Finley - 3/10 FG, 1/4 3PT, 0 REB, 1 AST, 1 STL, 7 PTS, 25 MIN
5. Jason Collins - 0/0 FG, 0/0 FT, 2 REB, 5 PF, 0 STL, 0 AST, 0 BLK, 26 MIN

RevScottDeMangeMD said...

Yeah Dan, but Kitna apologized for that costume.

Geoff said...

You can't really punish USC by not showing their games on TV. You end up also punishing every team they play. Big UCLA/USC matchup, sorry UCLA... no TV for you or your fans. Oregon having a huge year needing a win over USC to prove themselves... sorry, no one gets to see it. Dumb idea. You punish them more traditional ways. Take scholarships away, ban them from bowl games for a year or two, etc. But no punishment that potentially hurts other programs.

Jingoist said...

No mention of the possible Kobe to the Bulls for half the Bulls' roster (Deng, Thomas, Gordon, and your boy, Noah)? Wow.

Kobe is nixing the deal until the Lakers take it sans Deng. Hey, if the Lakers are going to purge the entire sum of the Bulls' talent, someone has to take a triple team away from Kobe, right? (Yes, I deliberately disregarded Wallace in that statement.)

Tunsney said...

The Torii Hunter talks prove that in this day and age, there is only one motivator...MONEY. At least Schilling left the Yankees off his list. They are a bitter rival with Boston. The White Sox are the Twins' biggest rival. Like Latrell Sprewell said after the Wolves offered him 27-30 MILLION. "They're not doing anything for me. I'm at risk. I have a lot of risk here. I got my family to feed.''

Sparty said...

Dan, the comment was from Boras, not the Yankees. He is trying to put spin on the opt out so that is client isn't put into a bad light and that the Yankees look like the big losers in this. The Yanks say that will not negotiate, and now he can say 'see we tried to talk to the Yanks, but they have chosen not to. They are the ones to be considered unreasonable.'
The Yankees will not re-sign A-Fraud, not a chance. I know one of your predictions was for that to happen, but to sensationalize a quote from Boras and turn it into a sudden development is ridiculous.

Matt T said...

Keeping a team off of TV only really punishes the fans. Who in most cases did nothing wrong. (Bad boosters are the exception there)

Sparty said...

typical Wizards. this is why they will not get out of the first round.

shpiders said...

@ Tunsney
RE: HUNTER

If I remember correctly, Hunter talked about giving the Twins a hometown discount - but what they offered him was more of an insult than anything else. Correct me if I'm wrong on that ...
If that happened to you, would you rule out signing with your teams rival?

Also, Hunter is good friends with Jermaine Dye - and the speculation in the Chicago media was that their friendship was a major factor in resigning Dye.

Tunsney said...

@ Shpiders
The Twins were in the "ballpark" as far as dollars but they did not offer enough years. I think they offered 3 and he wants a 5 year deal. I understand wanting to play with a friend, but I am sure he has more of them in Minnesota. He is the most loved sports figure in this state. It would be nice if the billionaire owner Pohlad would just open up his checkbook for once.

ToddTheJackass said...

Nice job on the Studs/Duds Guy.

Dan, I thought that the Reggie Bush gifts were supposedly all given in 2005? If so, the Heisman is possible to be revoked, but you certainly couldn't punish USC for 2004. I wonder how you'd feel if Florida got caught for something they [probably] did last year illegally.

Seems like a good day for the offseason MLB prediction thread, so here are 5 guys we can predict where they'll land:

1) A-Rod
2) Barry Bonds
3) Torii Hunter
4) Curt Schilling
5) Mike Lowell

Bonus: Who will be the biggest name traded, and to what team and for who will they be traded? Example: Johan Santana to the Dodgers for Clayton Kershaw and Andy LaRoche.

pv845 said...

1) A-Rod: Angels for a lot less than he wants
2) Barry Bonds: his couch
3) Torii Hunter: White Sox
4) Curt Schilling: a bar somewhere
5) Mike Lowell: Red Sox

ToddTheJackass said...

MLB Offseason predictions:

1) A-Rod - Dodgers (9yr - $29m/per)
2) Bonds - Rangers (1yr - $11m)
3) Torii - Rangers (5yr - $15m/per)
4) Schilling - Cubs (1yr - $12m)
5) Lowell - Red Sox (3yr - $12m/per)

Bonus: Johan and B- prospect to the Dodgers for Clayton Kershaw, Andy LaRoche, and Jonathan Meloan.

bkelly126 said...

@ todd
according to the story the gifts began in November 2004 and ended in January 2006. so both national championship games fall in the time span

Jingoist said...

Anyone else catch Letterman last night?

According to Papelbon, Big Papi is a bedazzler.

I don't even have (nor need) a witty comment to that.

Sparty said...

1) A-Rod (Tigers)
2) Bonds (Angels)
3) Hunter (Twins)
4) Schilling (Sox)
5) Lowell (Sox)

Big D said...

Damnit. Fell asleep before Letterman. I've turned into an old man really fast.

Also, about Bush's gifts... maybe it's naive, but if the football program didn't participate in the gift giving/receiving, how can they be punished? I can understand stripping Bush of the Heisman and nullifying any games he played in, but how can you punish the program going forward if they "didn't know" what was happening?

It's a lot harder to prove what someone knew instead of what someone did.

I'll come back later for Todd's game there. Good 5 choices BTW...

Sparty said...

i am usually able to stay up late enough to watch Great Moments in Presidential Speeches.

bkelly126 said...

big d,
doesn't not knowing fall under the category of "lack of institutional control"? you'd figure a coach could easily find out from somebody that one of his players is taking money from outside sources (or sources he hasn't approved). if sanctions are brought up against USC, what do you think the odds are that Carroll stays?

CMFost said...

DVR'd Papelbon last night and it was funny as hell when he said that Ortiz is a Bedazzler. I also thought Dave was going to have a heart attack when Papelbon was talking about what Ortiz said before game 5 against the Indians

CMFost said...

1) A-Rod - Giants
2) Bonds - A's
3) Torii - Braves
4) Schilling - Phillies
5) Lowell - Red Sox

CMFost said...

How about predicting a couple of other big names?

A. Jones - Dodgers
Glavine - Cubs
Bartolo Colon - Yankees
Posada - Dodgers
Rivera - Dodgers

CMFost said...

How about a prediction on Johan Santana?

Will he be traded? If so to who?

Yes and Boston

CMFost said...

There are actually some decent players that have filed for Free Agency so far.


Here is the list of who has filed

CMFost said...

Varitek knows exactly what he did with the ball used for the final out of the World Series. After Jonathan Papelbon [stats]’s Series-ending strikeout, Varitek stuffed the ball into a pocket before handing it over to the Sox closer the next day.

“I just didn’t know what to do with it and then it flashed in my mind, I better not drop it,” Varitek said. “So I stuffed it in my pocket. It was pretty weird. I already gave it to Pap. . . . It’s out of my hands.”

Papelbon’s agent, Sam Levinson, said his client doesn’t know where the ball is, and team spokesman John Blake said the club was unaware that the closer had it. . .


Ok so where is the Ball??

marcomarco said...

Colts-Pats.

I was thinking Pats by 21, but I 30 sounds better

Tim H. said...

Watching the replays after the W.S., I pointed out to my wife that Varitek was stuffing the ball in his back pocket while running to the mound (hand is behind back). Another angle shows something round in the pocket as the team is celebrating. What happened after that ????

Big D said...

Just for the record...

CBS' "expert picks" for this week's games, including Super Bowl 41-and-a-half (hat tip to D&C for that name... I like it).

Think the Pats have that on the bulletin board already?

Boomhauertjs said...

NBA Dud:
The entire Cavs team (except Big Z)-They are playing like a team that wants its coach fired.

shpiders said...

@ Tunsney
I don't remember the details, so you might be right about the offer the Twins made ... but I remember there being some issues with them money too. Ah well.
Bottom line is, Pohlad is cheap.

As a White Sox fan, I'd love to see him in Chicago ... but I'd also like to see Rowand back and I think he'd sign for less than Hunter (although, I think Hunter is the better player at this point).

As far as the free agents go:
1) A-Rod - Angels (outside chance - Cubs - if they can get their ownership sorted)
2) Bonds - A's (outside chance - Angels - don't know how A-rod would affect this)
3) Torii - White Sox (outside chance Phillies)
4) Schilling - Phillies (outside chance Red Sox)
5) Lowell - Red Sox (outside chance Yankees? - would he pull a Damon?)

What about the 2nd tier:
6) Andruw Jones - Dodgers
7) Jorge Posada - Mets
8) Aaron Rowand - Wherever Hunter doesn't sign
9) Bartolo Colon - retired?
10) Kenny Rogers - Detroit

pv845 said...

@ Big D: having gone through coaching recruiting for FB, the coach becomes like a new family member. This may sound bad, but they know exactly how poor you are and what you have. For a player to have such a drastic change in their finances, the coach or an assistant coach has to know what is going on. There are only two types of colleges programs, those that have been caught and those that haven't yet. It is a matter of degree.

shpiders said...

@ Big D and pv845:

Whether the coachs can say they didn't know anything or not - the NCAA will punish the program so that the boosters get punished too.

Although pv845 makes a good point about them probably knowing ...

I would throw one other type of program into your list:
Those that are cheating and have been caught, those that are cheating and haven't been caught and those that aren't cheating - but never win anything.

Matt T said...

No chance that Torii Hunter comes to Atlanta. They are shedding some salary to lock up Tex and get some pitching in. They've got very good young CF talent.

They are adding some payroll with the new ownership, so maybe Rowand?

CycleDan said...

Coaches in all big time IA programs cheat even if that cheating is looking the other way. I think the worst thing they do is look the other way when guys get all the PEDs. Most teams have one or two guys who supply them with the Testosterone, HGH and metabolic steroids. The strength and conditioning coach typically works with a guy or two to supply them. Of course the players never pay for their drugs.

Natsfan74 said...

I know it is unfair to the fans, and to fans of other teams, if USC gets banned from playing on TV, but that's something the NCAA has at its disposal. The NCAA banned Auburn from TV and from postseason appearances a few years ago.

Teams that are not on tv have a harder time recruiting (there goes all of that free advertising). This also reduces institutional giving (boosters) -- which indirectly punishes the team further. Finally, when teams have a TV ban imposed, the conference and NCAA do not share the TV revenue with that team. So banning a team from TV is a lot more effective than taking away scholarships as it has a far reaching effect.

And, really, who cares if USC has to take wins off of its historical record. Those players will keep their rings and the memories of winning the championship. Taking that way will have no real impact on them, or on USC's ability to recruit going forward. Hit them where it hurts -- in the wallet.

A-Rod - Angels
Bonds - Mariners
Hunter - Nationals (with Colon)
Schilling - Red Sox (h/t discount)
Lowell - Red Sox

CMFost said...

Here is another Free Agent:

Kerry Woods - Does he stay with the cubs or go somewhere else?

Tunsney said...

I think Kerry Woods' shoulder fell off last week. He is on IR for three more years.

Natsfan74 said...

ESPN has a fan ballot for ranking Halloween Candy.

They really have gone from reporting the news to making it....

Tunsney said...

ESPN is embarrassing. More and more of their articles end up on that damn Insider. What a joke to have to subscribe to that to read one or two good stories a month after you weed through all the garbage.

CMFost said...

If healthy I would not mind seeing the Red Sox sign Woods and put him in the Bullpen as a set up guy to Paps.

bkelly126 said...

taking a team of TV may have been effective years ago, but today there are too many other outlets a program can use to recruit. and besides, you think there is any high school kid in the country who has never heard of USC? take away scholarships or make them ineligible for bowl games.

ToddTheJackass said...

Ummm... I don't know if Tiger can play baseball. Sure, he's tall, and is probably pretty strong, but I don't know... Ohhh... you're talking about Kerry Wood...

Not helping your baseball knowledge cred there CM...

Beetle said...

Say Big D,
CBS has once again proved why no one considers them a serious source of sports news.
They just don't know what they are talking about.

cmfost said...

I dominate this blog and Boston dominates the world of Sports!

cmfost said...

Pats are number 1 !!!!!!!

cmfost said...

Sorry guys, I am on a sugar high, I just can't help myself. Life is to good.

Sparty said...

cmfost, after that, you are teetering on becoming a Troll.

Mark said...

Did someone hack CMFost's account? He's normally not THIS much of a douche.

Natsfan74 said...

OK, CM, stop it.

Kids have definitely heard of USC, but them not being on tv still makes recruiting harder. Tell a kid he will be on tv 8-10 times a year, which will help his visibility to NFL scouts, and it helps sell your school. Tell a kid "yeah, we have a great team, but your friends and family who do not live in Southern Cal will never see you play, and NFL scouts will miss a huge portion of your games" and that has a different sales pitch.

Half the players who sign at West Point do so just to be on tv. They know they will never be in the NFL, so go ahead and get on tv when you can. The Army Navy game is one of the most watched college football games in the world. And, Army has an ESPN contract to televise 4 home games a year. Since Army is competing with the likes of Holy Cross and Lehigh for players, think the tv thing has no impact?

pv845 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
kenjab said...

Interesting. If you look at the comments through the permalink (on danshanoff.com) instead of the blogger.com comments section, you can clearly tell that the last few posts were by an impostor, cmfost, not the real CMFost. Looks like you have a troll impostor there, CM.

chipp said...

No TV, no Bowl Games, reduction in scholarships: that's the punishment that USC should get. When Washington got caught, that was their punishment for 2 years. Programs need to be punished in a manner that will hinder the program and UW was certainly hindered. The loss of TV revenue is a hit, but the bigger hit is recruiting - what HS senior wants to NOT be seen on TV for 2 years?

GuyInTheCorner said...

Those werent CM. This has happend before. Just not for about 6 months. I guess someone got bored.

GuyInTheCorner said...

I think he might have been speaking drunk...

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2007/10/31/
mike-cameron-ive-played-drunk/

pv845 said...

I have a good feeling who it might have been and his name is a color.

pv845 said...

I mean it is Thursday and unfortunately we all know what happens on Thursdays usually.

TF said...

The NCAA cannot strip USC's titl, because they never gave them one.

Now the BCS can, but I doubt they will.

TF said...

Big D said...

Also, about Bush's gifts... maybe it's naive, but if the football program didn't participate in the gift giving/receiving, how can they be punished? I can understand stripping Bush of the Heisman and nullifying any games he played in, but how can you punish the program going forward if they "didn't know" what was happening?

It's a lot harder to prove what someone knew instead of what someone did.


I worked in compliance for a major D-I school. Trust me we knew if one of our players got a free soda on the tennis team.

There is no way USC didn't have at least a hint that Reggie Bush was getting benefits.

Now if they can show evidence that they tried to stop it, then their punishment might be more favorable. Most scools usually send out several CYA emails for these types of incidents.

I think thatifthe proof is there and USC gets in truble you'll see a loss of a few scholarships, money lost from bowls, etc.

CMFost said...

this is the real CMFost the other is fake, click on my profile and you can tell.

Jonathan said...

cmfost said...
I dominate this blog and Boston dominates the world of Sports!

I wonder why people are so sick of Boston

Beetle said...

Jonathan,
Once again you post a comment without availing yourself of the facts.
Now, apologize to cmfost!

Pow! The CHFF crews slams several of the Patriots "running it up" critics.
Or should I say hypo-critics.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/11_1797_Skeletons_in_the_closet.html

My favorite is Jason "we tend to back off" Campbell's Auburn team beating up on tinnie tiny Louisiana-Monroe 73-7. Back off indeed Jason!
You know, I went to grade school with a kid named Jason Campbell and he was a whiny little bitch as well.

Jonathan said...

the fact that cmfost is acting overly douchey today?

TF said...

imagine that a good majorty of Dan's readers are around my age (28) or so.

Now who during their day can make a fake screen name to make fun of CMFost?

Only some 20-something living in his parentsbasement with a cube of mountain dew and the World of Warcraft consuming most of his day before he has to go stock the shelves at Blockbuster.

Note: this is not to make fun of those who DO play world of warcraft nor those who may stock shelves atvideo stoores.

marcomarco said...

1) A-Rod - Angels, but not until May and for much less than 25m/yr.
2) Bonds - Home, or Texas 1yr/6mil.
3) Hunter (Twins 5yr/65mil)
4) Schilling (1yr/10mil)
5) Lowell (3yr/30mil)

marcomarco said...

@ jonathan

But, you act overly douchey every day.

Jonathan said...

Fine Marco, but do you really think Arod is going to get less then he makes now?

Tunsney said...

@Marco

You are my new favorite. I really want to see Torii back in a Twins uniform next spring.

@fake cmfost

You do a fairly good impression. Although you are a dick for doing that.

Jonathan said...

If J.D. Drew could get 14 mil then arod should be able to get at least double that.

marcomarco said...

Gotta love the WWL taking a quote out of context. Mountain out of a molehill.

Paps on Letterman

marcomarco said...

Agreed, comparitively Arod should make more than JD Drew. I just don't think that teams will want to extend themselves like Texas did.

I hope that Boras shoots himself and Arod in the foot, honestly. And it costs Arod time and reputation.

Boras makes the suggestions, but Arod calls the shots. Boras works for him.

Sparty said...

jonathon,

the Red Sox and Yankees always overpay for players, so JD Drew as the benchmark for A-Rods salary is bogus. He will not get more than what he was already making, maybe only get the deal longer. but not at an avg per year.

CMFost said...

marco isn't that the WWL job? And Paps was just great last night but I can not wait to see Manny on Leno that will probably be a high score on the unintentional comedy scale.

marcomarco said...

Fantastic article about 'running up the score' and hypocrites.

here

Highlight:
How's this for a four-game stretch of NFL greatness?

W, 49-14
W, 41-10
W, 41-9
W, 51-24

That quartet of one-sided scores comes to you courtesy of the 2004 Indianapolis Colts from a November-December period during which Peyton Manning and Co. annihilated the Texans, Bears, Lions, and Titans, respectively. And, you know it's funny, I don't remember one person whining about them running up the score.

CMFost said...

What I do not get about the A-Rod potential deal is why would anyone sign someone at his age to a 10 year deal? If I am any GM and BorASS calls and said do you want A-Fraud, I would tell him yes but we will only offer 5 year max.

CMFost said...

I love this line from the article:

"I can only imagine what Greg Easterbrook and the like might have written the morning after Wilt Chamberlain poured in 100 back in 1962, probably demanding an explanation as to why Wilt didn't sit out the fourth quarter against the poor, poor Knicks."

Sparty said...

Texans, Bears, Lions, and Titans,all were terrible in 2004. question is this. were they going for it on 4th down in the 4th and throwing the ball around?

marcomarco said...

Probably not, but they didn't have a coach with a chip on his shoulder either.

Fun times.

Natsfan74 said...

Great quote on Yahoo Sports from Bill Cowher, suggesting that some anonymous NFL team will take a cheap shot at Brady for the Patriots scoring.

Isn't that what he did to Carson Palmer in the playoffs a few years ago? What looked possible but doubtful a few days ago now seems like a realistic coaching strategy that Cowher endorses. Hmmmm......

Jonathan said...

CMFost said...
What I do not get about the A-Rod potential deal is why would anyone sign someone at his age to a 10 year deal? If I am any GM and BorASS calls and said do you want A-Fraud, I would tell him yes but we will only offer 5 year max.

and he would say ok thanks I'll go play somewhere else

Sparty said...

we all saw that hit on palmer, that wasn't a cheap shot.

Sparty said...

for the very last time. Jonathon, no one is going to offer him more than what the Yanks were proposing as an extension, and essentially he turned them down. So he has screwed himself once already. No one is allowing themselves to get locked into the deals anymore, including the Yanks.

with that said...no more replies to the irrevelent jonathon. he uses no rational thinking to his arguments, especially when it comes to A-Fraud and BorAss.

Sparty said...

Rip Hamilton to miss tonights game because of undisclosed family emergency.

Hope all is OK Rip!

Jonathan said...

Fine but when he get over 30 mil per year for at least 8 years you all owe me an apology

Luke Bell said...

I brought this very thing up earlier. The Colts were not going for it on 4th down in field goal range or throwing the ball all over the field. In fact, the game against the Bears featured 204 rushing yards for Edge against 211 passing yards from Manning. The Colts rushed 39 times and passed 28. The Colts passed 7 times in the entire 2nd half, and they even ran the ball on 4th & 10 on the Bear 18 (with the 3rd string running back) instead of kicking the field goal.

I don't want to take the time to look up the other games, but I'm willing to bet it was pretty similar.

And I do remember Patriots fans (or rather, Brady fans) whining about Brady not getting the respect that Manning got, because Brady was more of a "leader" and a "winner" while Manning was "selfishly padding his numbers."

Mills said...

Wood. It is Kerry Wood.

Jeez.

Jonathan said...

good point Luke, hopefully you shut a few people up

Sparty said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sparty said...

look, i get it. belicheck is pissed at the league and is taking it out on them. does Tom deserve to take a hit? well he is the face of the franchise, so if someone takes it upon themselves to deck him, oh well so be it.
however i do kinda go along with the camp of why don't you take all that energy towards knocking out brady and instead just stop the pats? where is the pride in the defense?

We haven't discussed the defensive side of NE either. It is not like they are sending odd man rushes every play either. so whatever. Let them be undefeated going into week 17 at the Meadowlands. we knocked off Denver when they were going for the undefeated thing and they were 12-0 (Kent Graham!), we will do it again.

CMFost said...

Jonathan said... CMFost said...
What I do not get about the A-Rod potential deal is why would anyone sign someone at his age to a 10 year deal? If I am any GM and BorASS calls and said do you want A-Fraud, I would tell him yes but we will only offer 5 year max.

"and he would say ok thanks I'll go play somewhere else"


That was not my question, I know that BorASS would probably tell the team to go screw if they said they would only give A-Fraud 5 years but my question was why would anyone give him 10 Years at his age or even 8?

voiceofreason said...

At this point, the only thing more annoying than Belichick is the Patriots' fans who refuse to just admit he's running up the score. The guy is a screaming a$$hole with a vendetta. Whether you agree with him or not, that's what he is. So just get comfortable with it. Stop bringing up other team's NFL or college scores. You're taking the good that comes with Belichick (lots of wins), so take the bad too (everybody hates him, and therefore the team).

I don't have a problem with professionals running up the score on other professionals, but as a non-Pats fan, I do hope that Belichick's arrogance costs them in the form of a key player getting hurt in the 4th quarter of a lopsided game they have no basis for still being in. Not intentionally hurt, just hurt.

Sparty said...

Jason Whitlock said "9. OK, having said all of that, let me explain the hypocrisy of all the crying about the Patriots' never-let-off-the-gas offense.

We don't whine when defenses refuse to back down.

You ever see a defensive coordinator throw his starters back out on the field in an effort to preserve a shutout? Happens all the time, and no one sheds a tear.

Yep, if a defense goes to great lengths to protect its statistical ranking or set some sort of record, no one cares. It's obvious Belichick and the Patriots want to go down in history as an all-time great offense. That would be quite an accomplishment for a head coach who made his bones as a defensive guru.

The Patriots are also taking a team run at history. This could be the greatest team of all time. Even if the Patriots slip and lose a game, they could still be regarded as superior to the '72 Dolphins and the '85 Bears."

Sparty said...

jason whitlock also said "If Belichick wants to score points in the fourth quarter of routs, someone needs to put Brady, Moss and Wes Welker on blast."

Jonathan said...

Because cmfost, if you want him for 5 you are going to have to take him for 8, he won't sign a five year deal. If you don't offer it to him another team will.

shpiders said...

I think someone else posted this a few days ago (I can't remember where I saw it) ...
But rather than taking out a player, why not send a TE on a sideline route towards Belichick ... then overthrow him a little.
The TE will be looking for the ball not Belichick.

Sparty said...

cmfost, wasting your breath.

CMFost said...

So Jonathan if no one offers him a 8 year deal which might be a probability is he not going to sign and sit out a year or is only going to play if he gets an 8+ year deal?

pv845 said...

I don't see anyone offering A-Rod that length of deal. I would think that he has to decline in ability over that period of his career. Bonds only improved with the known assistance.

too_quiet said...

Re: Pats / Belichik

No matter whether you call it "running up the score" or "awesome domination", the existence of all the heated discussion shows that it is of debatable sportsmanship and class. I didn't say it *is* bad sportsmanship, or low-class, but it is obviously *debatable* (pretty much by definition). That alone seems enough of a reason not to do it. Sure, it will not be justified when some defender whose pride is hurt puts a little more mustard on a hit late in the game, but why fan that fire? Revenge or "F-you" to the league? Not very professional, not very smart.

I do enjoy watching a superior team have its way, and the Patriots are fun to watch, but I can't condone going for it on fourth-and-goal late in the game etc. It's bullying, and I don't see the benefit. I don't feel sorry for the opponents -- they are professionals and they do not want sympathy for being outplayed. But I don't see why being "professional" means that there cannot be a code of conduct. There are even codes of conduct in war. Mainly it is "arms race" reasoning, where, for example, you all agree not to torture POWs, not because you necessarily think it's wrong to torture the enemy, but because you are willing to give up torturing them in order to not have your people tortured. Ok I am rambling on at this point, and I hope the two readers who stuck with it this far did not get offended by the war analogy.

The heroin sheik said...

College players pay for their drugs, just look at major parker for the UF basketball team. They just dont pay for their PED's.

As to the Colts running up the score in 04 anyone who payed attention to the bucs when dungy was there knows he never runs up the score. Hell one time he was on the 1 yrd line with a few minutes left and called a play where the rb ran out of bounds without being touched. He is too nice to run up the score.

I was thinking maybe Belichick is running up the score to make up for how much the Browns sucked when he was there.

The heroin sheik said...

OH yeah anyone see how Martina HIngis was supposedly popped for doing blow during Wimbledon. She is hot and a cokehead. Nice!

starkweather said...

"I don't see anyone offering A-Rod that length of deal. I would think that he has to decline in ability over that period of his career. Bonds only improved with the known assistance." Right. And there's no chance that A-Rod has done all the same stuff. No way. And he never will...

Nobody points out that if Dan is picking the Pats by 30 it's probably a good idea to bet everything you have on the Colts.

Sparty said...

starkweather, A-Rods name has yet to come up yet in regards to PEDs, and he deserves the benefit of the doubt. When he was in high school and the minors he was being considered to be the next great positional player and he delivered. But hey, the most credible source on steroids may have something in his next book, Mr. Jose Conseco. wait and see...

pv845 said...

I wasn't saying that A-Rod doesn't or won't, but I know that if his skills increase as much as Bonds did during that time, then we will hear all about A-Rod and PEDs. No team wants that.

Good point about the Colts-Pats though.

CMFost said...

has anyone really taken the time to look at A-Fraud and how much bigger he has gotten over the years. I would almost 100% guarantee he is or has been on some sort of PED.

CMFost said...

Do not forget that Tony Dungy compared the Patriots to Barry Bonds when the cameragate stuff was coming out and do not think for a second the players are not using that for motivation. Actually I would not be surprised that somewhere in the Patriots locker room there is not a poster of Bonds.

Sparty said...

look at Jeter now and when Jeter came up, big difference too. but young guys don't hit the weights until they get into the league.

Tunsney said...

A-Rod can suck down, inject, and wipe on all the drugs he wants. It has yet to help him in October. He is no doubt an unbelievable player that will help almost any team get to the playoffs, but that is the end of the road for his production. So go ahead, give this stiff 300 mil.

Sparty said...

well said tunsey, well said.

Jonathan said...

C'mon guys, Arod was a kid when he came up, he hasn't gained more weight and bulk then a normal adult who works out.

You're 100% guarentee dosn't mean shit, especially considering that you don't like him. And if he olny get a 5 year deal I promise I will never post on this site ever again.

Tunsney said...

@ Jonathan

What you don't get is I actually like A-Rod. He is one of those guys that just looks like he is going yard every time he steps to the plate during the regular season. He is just not a complete player that can do it when it matters most. I hope I never hear that he has taken anything.

Sparty said...

scotty brosius could get the job done though!

Jonathan said...

tunsey, before game 5 of the Sox series in 2004 he was a .361 post season hitter in around 80 at bats, so he has gotten it done when it matters in the past despite what everybody likes to believe.

And that comment about hating Arod was directed at cmfost

Sparty said...

2004? ugh, what about 2005, or 2006, or 2007? It is like the Don Mattingly HoF argument. He was great from 84-89, so just forget about 90-95.

Natsfan74 said...

ARod will get another 8-10 year contract. I'm sure Boras tested the waters (stopping short of meddling, which would surely be outlawed) before making the move. He knew JD Drew would get more money. He knows ARod will too.

He has 2 real selling points -- 1 is the HR record. If a team wants 5 years, why not 8? 8 makes him a lock to break the HR record in your uniform. And, if you go 8, why not go 10? With 10, you've got a great chance of seeing him break Pete Rose's hits record in your uniform too. The guy has a career record of regular season performance -- high BA, high HR, no injuries. So if you would go 5, you would go 8, you would surely go 10.

But, the teams most likely to do that are teams with more to gain than winning. The Cubs sell out every game and have a great cable network, so they don't need ARod. Same with the Yankees. The Mets could use the revenue boost he would provide -- especially after their collapse this year -- but they don't have a position for him.

But, the 2 LA teams could both use a boost in ticket sales, and a competitive edge in the local cable market. So, if ARod can help teams increase their revenue ('cause he surely can't help them with a WS), he is a valuable commodity. And that value is worth an 8-10 year contract.

Jonathan said...

scotty brosius, who I love, has a .245 post season avg, about 30 points lower then Arod

CMFost said...

Hey Jonathan what has a team he has been on ever one other the a Division Championship or a wild card berth?

Has he even been on a World Series Team?

A-Fraud is a great player and with probably go down as one of the greatest Regular Season Players ever but great regular seasons only get you to the playoffs they do not win you Championships.

Sparty said...

I belive A-Rod will get the years, just not the per year salary which is what guys really want. In all he will receive more money than his current deal had left. However he will not make 26per.

Jonathan said...

Sparty, I didn't say forget about it, I was refuting the fact that he's never gotten in done in the post season.

CMFost said...

But Scott Brosius has a World Series Ring and A-Fraud does not.

Sparty said...

hmmm, but i also remember scott brosius has a game winning world series home run and a world series MVP. no doubt A-Rod is the better offensive player. but scotty came up big.

CMFost said...

Why do you not sign A-Rod to a 8+ Year deal? Because if you pay $30 Mill a year and he gets a career ending injury in year 2 your team is screwed for 8 years. At his age if I was a GM I would not sign him to that long of deal, maybe 5 with some options years based on performance in years 4&5 of the deal.

Jonathan said...

You are right, Arod has never been to a world series, but you can say the same thing about most the league.

Also he came awefully close in 2004, if Rivera closes out game 4, which he almost always does, then Arod goes to the world series.

Sparty said...

so we are gonna blame a guy who has come up big w/ rings, instead of the guy who doesn't come up big. i hate the "Rivera cost him his chance" argument. HIT THE FUCKING BALL!

Sparty said...

Jonathon, you listen to Mike and the Mad Dog waaaayyyy too much.

Tunsney said...

Calm down Sparty...you are making my wife blush.

Speaking of Rose...two things:
1. If Ichiro was here from the start (up from the minors) would he destroy the hits record?
2. Should Rose be in the Hall of Fame? Should they reinstate him?

Sparty said...

sorry. I was a big A-Rod supporter when he was here with the yanks, and kept believing he would get out of the post season slump, but he succumbed to the NY pressure.

Jonathan said...

Dude all I'm saying is if rivera closes that game arod is in the world series and all of this "arod has never been to a world series" talk never happens.

Look, I agree that he hasn't come up big in the post season the last couple of years, I just don't think you guys are being fair or accurate.

cmfost, we get you would not sign him to a deal longer then 5 years, but somebody else would and they would take the risk to get him on their team. Also, unlike some players he plays through injuries and rarely gets hurt. What a fraud!

pv845 said...

A-Rod has started to choke when his team needed him. In the previous years, the team wasn't going anywhere and there was no pressure. Now that he is the supposed leader of the team, and the team depends on him for production, he disappears.

No Ichiro wouldn't and yes the MLB should reinstate Pete as a player.

Jonathan said...

I agree Sparty, although I feel like even if he hit better they still lose the last 3 years.

Jonathan said...

pv845, I'd say his team needed him pretty bad this year, and all he did was have the best season for a yankee since mantle

marcomarco said...

@ sparty

Let them be undefeated going into week 17 at the Meadowlands.


Sorry pal, this one's in Gilette. If you thought the Pats were running up the score before, you will see an absolute clinic for this one.

Sparty said...

but rivera didn't, and A-Rod has had his opportunities to help them win and he didn't. we live in a what have you done lately world. as a playoff contender you have to take into consideration his postseason performances and the idea that you will have to probably play either the Yanks or the Sox in the playoffs, and all that pressure will be back to perform

Sparty said...

nope, at Giants Stadium Marcomarco. check again. season ticket holder here. my uncle is pats holder and asked to come down for the game.

marcomarco said...

@ voiceofreason

Patriots' fans who refuse to just admit he's running up the score.


Who are you referring to? No one here is denying that anymore. For the record, I never denied it (but enjoy it)

Sparty said...

Mantle 18 postseason HRs

CMFost said...

1. If Ichiro was here from the start (up from the minors) would he destroy the hits record? probably

2. Should Rose be in the Hall of Fame? Should they reinstate him?
yes and no

Tunsney said...

@ PV
Do you say that based on him not playing long enough? He has averaged almost 230 hits a year for the 7 he has played.

Tunsney said...

Don't they need to reinstate him before he is eligible?

marcomarco said...

@ jonathan

Jonathan said...
Because cmfost, if you want him for 5 you are going to have to take him for 8, he won't sign a five year deal. If you don't offer it to him another team will.


Which is why he will be unsigned going into May and have to 'settle'.

At least, i hope this is how it plays out.

pv845 said...

@ Jonathen: Yea he did during the regular season, but his .267 BA this year stunk. Though on the bright side it was an improvement over his post-season BA of .071 last year and his .133 the year before.

Tunsney said...

I am not sure if anyone mentioned this yet but how dumb is Mike Cameron. When was that test administered? Nice timing jack@ss.

Sparty said...

a-rod will have to settle, but before May and for about 20 mil per. lol, settle for 20 mil.

tunsey, per the rules, yes they have to reinstate him. but they probably could come up with some exemption to get him into the Hall.

CMFost said...

marcomarco said...

@ sparty

Let them be undefeated going into week 17 at the Meadowlands.

Sorry pal, this one's in Gilette. If you thought the Pats were running up the score before, you will see an absolute clinic for this one.


Marcon sorry but you are wrong the Pats play the Jets in foxboro on 12/16 but play the Giants at the meadowlands on 12/29

Sparty said...

antonio pierce is known for late hits on QBs

marcomarco said...

@ Dan Shanoff

Dan, please frame/preserve this promise somewhere on your front page. (typos and all)

Jonathan said...

And if he olny get a 5 year deal I promise I will never post on this site ever again.

Tunsney said...

He is talking about Buster from the WWL.

pv845 said...

I just think that Ichiro would slow down. I recognize that he has had some amazing seasons, but at 230 hit average he would need over 18 seasons to break the record. I think it is asking a lot for that type of consistency, but I could be wrong.

marcomarco said...

@ sparty

My bad, i thought you were referring to the 2nd Jets game (week 15)

Giants could be a landmine, as could the Ravens. Both road games.

Sparty said...

look, Jeter is breaking that hits record, how many times do I have to say it?

Sparty said...

marcomarco,

those are the two teams (Giants/Ravens) that the pats may actually see a pass rush. This of course is saying that the Giants are still healthy. they have never stayed healthy a whole season back to 2000.

Tunsney said...

Sparty...your a bigger homer than Simmons. Just kidding. Why did you give up on your blog after one post?

Tunsney said...

Sparty,

You are not including that 2000 season are you? Or was it the 99 when the Gmen embarrassed my Vikings. 41-0? That is a Smith Center Kansas type beatdown.

Sparty said...

lol, i am a Homer, not afraid to admit it. but i am not afraid to admit that the Red Sox may have a 3 year run started too. as for my "blog" its something i played around with for family and friends, but found a better vehicle to use instead.

Sparty said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sparty said...

well, 99-2000 season. yes the 41-0 rout. but i was also at the 97 playoff game. freakin calloway!

Beetle said...

I'd hate to say it,
But I agree with Jonathan regarding A-Rod.
I think it is unlikely he has taken any PEDs, the guy is just a freakish talent, and while he won't get a 10 year deal, he'll get a 6-8 year deal no doubt.
Part of the draw to signing A-Rod long term is to reap the benefits (increased attendance, national TV exposure) if/when he shatters Bonds all-time HR record.
It will take him more than 5 years to do that.

Beetle said...

Sparty,
Jeter is not going to break the all time hits record, although he will like push past 3,500 hits.

Write this down and remember you heard it hear first.
Hanley Ramirez is going to break the all time hits record.
The guys is super-young and a superfreak hitter.
Only a devastating injury will be able to stop him

Sparty said...

beetle, i think hanley could do it. i do not think Jeter will, but of established players, he has the best shot.

marcomarco said...

I like Hanley Ramirez, but please. You can't even consider someone for that record until they reach 2000 hits.

People used to say that about Wade Boggs, who rattled off 8ish 200 hit seasons in a row. Final total? 3010 in 18 years.

Ramirez only has about 3850 to go.

marcomarco said...

I thought this was clever.

Girardi picks #27

CMFost said...

Marco but Boggs might had a chance if he did not take so long to get out of the minor leagues.

Beetle said...

Marco,
No one said that Wade Boggs would break the record, he didn't break into the Bigs until he was past his 26th birthday. \
Hanley will have over 2000 hits before his 30th birthday.
You can talk about anyone you want with over 2,000 hits, but NO ONE in all of MLB has a shot except for Hanley, unless either Jeter, or Arod play productively well into their mid to late 40s.
The one problem Hanley will have is if he keeps developing more power, he will probably be moved out of the leadoff position.

marcomarco said...

For those of you who missed it, like me:

Papelbon on Letterman