Tuesday, October 17, 2006

"Monday Night Miracle":
Bears Win, Cards Choke

Tuesday A.M. Quickie found below this post.

"Monday Night Miracle"
: That's what last night's game is already being called. Instant classic? Perhaps not the game; certainly the fourth quarter, a jaw-dropping series of events.

When Tony Kornheiser was talking about the Cards choking away the game, up 23-10 in the middle of the 4th quarter, I pshawed his talk – why piss on one of the most glorious results in Cards franchise history? They were about to seal the most staggering, unexpected win of the 2006 season. Why was he hammering this stale point? Why... --

Then the Bears D. And the fumble recovery for a TD. And the Bears D. And the Devin Hester punt return for a TD. And the Bears D. And the missed FG by the normally money Neil Rackers. And the Bears D.

It doesn't matter that they SHOULD have lost the game last night; they didn't. They weathered a gruesome game from Rex Grossman and the offense and stole one. Teams en route to a one of Those Seasons – a title season – get those kind of wins.

And this one meant more than any of the previous beat-downs the Bears have delivered this season.

What about Leinart? You had to feel for Matt Leinart. On a national stage, he came up huge. He picked apart the Bears defense in a way no one thought he would (or could). I'm willing to join the reformed naysayers who questioned his NFL bonafides: Leinart is legit.

(Hell, after that performance, we can start asking questions like: Should the Titans have taken Leinart? Should the Jets? Should the Raiders? Should the Bills? Should the Texans?)

Grossman stinks it up: Meanwhile, on the other side of the spectrum, Rex Grossman had 6 turnovers. Six! I can't even imagine what his fantasy points situation was, after 4 INTs and 2 lost fumbles. (In my league scoring, Grossman had -10 points.) Yikes. Needless to say, it's possible Grossman's luster wore off last night.

I wonder if any FFL GMs who started Grossman LOST a Monday-afternoon week-winning lead because of him. (OMG, I just checked: The guy IN MY LEAGUE with Grossman was leading his game 49-29 heading into last night. His opponent had Anquan Boldin (+12); this poor schlub had Grossman (-10). A guaranteed win becomes a contender for "Worst Loss Ever."

Dennis Green blows up: After the game, all eyes were on Green's meeting with the media. And he provided the Quote of the Day:

"If you want to crown them, just crown their ass... We let them off the hook." He's not wrong, on either count.

NFL "Flex" TV Scheduling Hearts the Bears: Word is starting to leak out about the negotiations about which games NBC will poach from Fox and CBS to move from Sunday afternoon to Sunday night in primetime. Unsurprisingly, the Bears will be a hot choice (although I predicted after that MNF game in New Orleans a few weeks ago -- with sky-high ratings -- that if the Saints look like they're legit, they should see plenty of Sunday night airtime).

Finally, here's some hilarity: A link to the Comments area for last night's pre-game, mid-game and post-game post about the Bears. Note how the tone changes. Check it out here.

-- D.S.


Christian Thoma said...

Here's my Question of the Day: What was the bigger tank job, MSU or Arizona? And can we get ESPN Classic to show them back-to-back?

nyc-steelers fan said...

Was anyone else wishing Charles Barkley would have stayed in the booth the entire night? He had more charisma than the other three schmoes put together. And notice how he instantly had a chemistry with Joe (not with Tony, who argues so much, with that whiny voice of his, that its a wonder he has chemistry with anyone. Oh, that's right, he doesn't).

But last night's games was one of the worst ever. Who can make the most mistakes? It was one of those games that makes you think, 'It's a shame that either team has to win.' But I give the Bear's D credit, they played a good 45 minutes.

Really though, Arizona's defense did not deserve to lose that game. I feel bad for them. But I don't feel bad for arizona's offense. they have too much talent to choke the game away like that. But maybe that's the problem, all those glory boys, but no solid role players...

Hende said...

And in the span of one night, the 2006 Bears have changed from being compared to the '85 Bears to the '01 Bears, compensating a poor offense with defense and special teams. Grossman had a wretched, deer-in-the-headlights performance against the vaunted Arizona D, and I can hear the pitter-patter of columnist's keyboards as they type their newfound support for Griese. The Bears will go about 13-3 this year, get a first round bye, but get knocked out of the playoffs due to poor QB decisions.

Fantasy-wise, I was down by four pts last night, against a guy who started Grossman. Our league scored Grossman at -1, but luckily I had the Chicago D.

Gary said...

Sir Charles was a great prognosticator, despite saying "go for the juggler"

I think everyone in that stadium (and watching at home) knew that when the Cards were held to those FGs in the first half, they were done, I mean, come on, they were in great field position all first half and they ended up with field goals.

Dennis Green kept running with Edge, who is officially the biggest fraud in the league this season, there is no way that guy is a top tier back, no way. I don't care how bad your o-line is, if you can't break one or two 20+ yard runs in 35 carries you just aren't worth the big bucks that Arizona is paying you. PERIOD

Christian Thoma said...

Hold on a second. The Arizona O-Line is freakin' horrible. Edge set a record for most futile running game. They had like fifty-seven false start penalties. Totally amateur hour. Matt Leinart is like the 7-foot guy playing on a freshman basketball team. Not to mention they were short Larry Fitz.

In the end, the game was lost by coaching. At least twice the Cards clammed up and settled for a FG. They ran over 70 plays but still couldn't get the clock to run out early for them. And let's not forget the idiocy of punting to someone instead of out-of-bounds. Grossman had been beyond pathetic all day--why even give Special Teams a chance?

Christian Thoma said...

Also, I want to reiterate for the fifth or sixth time: why the hell was Boldin able to get so many catches? Leinart had one guy he was throwing to, and the defense didn't adjust. The Bears had ALL FREAKING OFFSEASON to address the reason why they lost in the playoffs last year AND THEY DIDN'T.

That, my friends, is why they won't make it far in the playoffs this year, no matter which Grossman shows up.

Anonymous said...

thanks to grossman I went from having 19 FFL teams at 5-0 to only 3 at 6-0. Those 3 were the ones I was LUCKY enough not to have him, and was instead lucky enough to have Alex Smith or Donovan starting.

SIGH. on the default ESPN settings sexy rexy only put up a -7, on yahoo! with fractional scoring he put up an even better -9.39

but the bears are still 6-0. just not sure now if we can say it is the bears, and everyone else.

Tim said...

My poor ass... I went into last night tied in my fantasy league. I started Grossman, the other guy was done. In my league, he scored -9... Damn him!!

Richard said...

This may be VERY premature, but where does Leinart rank among NFL quarterbacks right now? I mean, does this ranking make sense?
1. Brady
2. P. Manning
3. McNabb
4. Palmer
5. Hasselbeck
6. Delhomme
7. E. Manning
8. Bulger
9. Roethlisberger
10. LEINART???

That can't be right can it? Could Leinart be a top 10 QB after TWO starts?

jvaldon said...

Can the Bears say NO to the flex scheduling?

The bears tend to shit the bed on night games (Seattle this year was not typical)

Even if the Bears get through the New York leg of the schedule, I wouldnt be suprised if they lose to St. Louis Week 14 on MNF

Phil said...

What the heck was RT Ross doing on the play in which Leinart was sacked and gave up the fumble that Mike Brown took in for the TD? I feel bad for Leinart on that play (and I am not a Leinart fan). Ross looked straight downfield and touched NO ONE, leaving the DE with a free blindside shot at the QB. Unbelievable!

nyc-steelers fan said...

No Richard, it can't be right. A QB who has never won a game, and has never prevented his team from choking double digit leads, is not a top 10 QB. Put Alex Smith ahead of him, Put Penninngton ahead of him, for gods sake put brees ahead of him, put Kitna ahead of him, put Mcnair ahead of him, put leftwich ahead of him, put Bledsoe ahead of him, put Brad johnson ahead of him, put plummer ahead of him. He's there with carr and losman, ahead of the arron brooks' of the world, though.

Christian Thoma said...


I think it was John Clayton that said it, but someone mentioned that an audible was called, and that caused the problem with the protection. Granted, the O-Linemen should've done something to stop him (heck, a holding penalty would've been fine), but the blame partially rests with Leinart for calling the audible. Or maybe with Denny Green for calling a play that Leinart needed to audible from.

Anonymous said...

I'll still take Grossman's production over the whole season so far compared to the 2 wk hero of Donte Stallworth and his magical hamstring of doom.

Christian Thoma said...

Sorry nyc-steelers fan, I'm leaning towards richard's idea. If Rackers makes two FGs, Leinart is 2-0 and smelling like roses. It's all about relative value; I assure you the Lions would rather have Leinart over Kitna right now.

Anonymous said...

And I bet the Cards would rather have Jason Hanson :)

Robin's Towel Boy said...

Grossman shit the bed last night, and that's unfortunate for fantasy owners who started him, but I have an even more atrocious story of fantasy woe. I'll try to keep it brief:
We play individual D players, and our scoring is slightly modified. The important thing is that going into last night's game I was down 5 points and my opponent and I each had one fantasy player left: me, Lance Briggs; him, Charles Tillman.
I went from not caring about the game to watching Briggs play like a man possessed, racking up tons of tackles and a couple pass deflections. My opponent who also happens to be my roommate calls me from the library where he's studying and has to watch the game on stat tracker. There's 5 or 6 minutes left and he's now down 6 points, with Briggs putting on one of the best individual defensive fantasy performances all year and Tillman recording a paltry 3 tackles and one pass defense.
I answer the phone as Leinart steps under center, and I tell my roommate that he's pretty much cooked. In fact I tell him, the only way he's pulling this one out is a Tillman touchdown, which we both laugh, is highly unlikely. And just as I'm revelling in my victory, Edge puts the ball on the carpet, and none other than Charles Tillman scoops it up and runs untouched to paydirt.
At this point the Cardinals were still looking like winners, but my fantasy game was pretty much over. Sure Grossman was a touch one to swallow, but a Tillman touchdown for a loss was a gut punch fantasy game of the highest order.

Richard said...

OK i admit, I should have had Brees. But come on. Kitna? Bledsoe? Leftwich (who may not be as good as his backup)? Alex Smith (and I'm a 49ers fan)?

I'll take Leinart over all of them.

TJ said...

Wow, Dan. Isn't sharing about your fantasy team a HUGE Quickie No-No? I'll agree though--that is a great story (and I'll bet there are hundreds just like all over the country). This could go down as the greatest fantasy game of all time.

mattie said...

we can start asking questions like: Should the Titans have taken Leinart? Should the Jets? Should the Raiders? Should the Bills? Should the Texans?

Ummmm...as a Jets fan, I'll speak for myself and say that I was asking that question WAY before last night. Yes, Chad's been healthy -- **knocksonwoodeverywhere** -- but the Jets JUST SAW what injuries to your quarterback can do to you. And there are still no long-term guarantees with Mr. Pennington...why not take a potentially great QB with the 4th pick!?!?! So that Mr. Belichick disciple can look super-duper smart or something, by eschewing the 'flash' of a high-profile position by strengthening the line? Give me a break. This past draft was the ultimate in pointless, self-congratulatory over-thinking and Leinart going 10th, along with Bush not going first, are the prime examples of that.

Mega said...

All I saw was a bunch of whining, crying, moaning, and boo-hooing from the comments in last nights game.

Hey KURT, guess what?


Do you think that the record books will have an asterick next to the final score of last nights game with the side note "The win was a fluke, the Bears got lucky"?


Oh, by the way, I'm also guessing that whoever beats the Yankees in the playoffs, in your eyes, is just "lucky". ::rolls eyes::

john (east lansing, mi) said...

yeah, nyc-steelers, you're right - Tony has never had chemistry with anyone.

No wonder they cancelled PTI after a month.

FutureLegendVinceYoung said...

I love the Instant History people are showing towards McNabb and Grossman because they had a down game and in Grossman's case he looked like Alex Smith from last year against the Cardinals.

Scoop Jackson has an article talking about which McNabb will show up for the rest of the season because he had a mediocre game against the Saints.

Sometimes I think that IH is fun but in this case it is ridiculous to doubt what McNabb is going to bounce back and I think Grossman had a great attitude about it talking about how bad he was last night.

Lenny said...

i needed 5 points to win in my VERY high scoring fantasy league last night. I had Grossman starting, which meant I was pretty much guarenteed to win. I had benched Carson Palmer to play Grossman. 6 turnovers later, I lost by 10 points. More than somewhat pissed.........

Christian Thoma said...

There's nothing wrong with being lucky, Bears Fans. Luck is what allows you to win games you shouldn't, whether you're losing because your QB has a 10 rating or because you're playing a team more talented than you. Luck is not a bad thing.

As Sirian's Law(tm) states, Sometimes It Is Better To Be Lucky Than Good.

So stop acting all offended, you're just coming off like whiners.

Brian in Oxford said...

I think Dennis Green's "The Bears are who we thought they were!" line rivals Herm Edwards "We play...to win....the game!"

Anyone else agree?

How's it rank with "Playoffs?!!!" and "We didn't do diddly poo" from Jim Mora?

Gary said...

Hey, I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned it yet, but did you hear that Rex Grossman had a bad Fantasy football game? I wonder if it ruined anyones games.

Hearing about people's fanstasy football teams is like hearing about someone's golf round, the person telling the story thinks its interesting, but rest assured, he's the ONLY one

Liberal Arts Majors said...

1.) Sir Charles was really awesome upstairs.
2.) Leinart is not at all in the top 15. He's lucky to be starting right now. HOWEVER (!) by the end of the season, he'll be in that top ten echelon.
3.) This past week's fantasy football points were a fluke. Either teams went balls to the wall high, or those who were always good, hit a slow week. Too many guys (Holt, TO, LT2, etc.) had ENORMOUS days and it'll all even out eventually.
4.)Phil, GREAT call. Especially after I had just finished michael lewis' new book. Ross literally did not touch a soul. Audible or not, HE'S THERE TO COVER THE ASS OF MATTY HOLLYWOOD!

Cody said...

I didn't see anything impressive about Leinart's performace. Maybe it was impressive from a Cardinals QB perspective (they have never had a good one). Leinart had zero down the field completions, 3-4 medium range, the rest and bulk of his passes were dink and dunk passes. Most of he passing yards came on RAC. He looked shakey under pressure and did not do much in the second half when the Bears D decided they had better start playing.

The Arizona D looked impressive. They had 6 take aways and gave Leinart a short field to work with for much of the first half. Leinart should have turned 6 turn overs and a constant short field into TD's instead of FG's.

Jake C said...

Everyone's first mistake...thinking Grossman could carry your fantasy team...as much as even I like him and think he can be a good/solid QB - I would NEVER trust my fantasies to him.

Denny Green's quote = best quote this season to date.

Anyone else enjoy the visual progression of Charles' weight gain on his highlight reel?

Oh...no mention yet...but Mike Tyson wants to fight women - in the RING this time!

big.aaron said...

Guys thanks for all the fantasy team stuff. If you don't mind I would like bi weekly updates on everybody's fantasy team. Please email them to icouldn'tcareless@justshutup.com
Again, thanks.

Jared said...

Heading into last night I was down 4 with no one left to play, but Grossman bailed me out. I think it's ridiculous how many people forgot about Leinart. He was the surething number 1 pick 2 years ago, then his senior year he was great and lead USC to the championship game. But because of the hype of Reggie Bush and the overhype of Vince Young, Leinart was dropped to a second-rate player. No good reason behind it.

Unknown said...

I had Grossman...C. Johnson..R. Johnson...

My fantasy team totalled 23 points...i got beat by 40. lol

Top 10 QBs!

P. Manning
E. Manning

And I'd put Rivers, Kitna (yes, Kitna), McNair, Gradkowski ahead of Leinart.

ndyanksfan05 said...

No way roethlisberger is that high - no chance. He is strictly a manage the offense QB and I just don't trust him with two minutes to go needing to drive his team to a win. His main job is to hand the ball off and not throw interceptions (by throwing short passes and letting his receivers make plays) He's in the top fifteen but no where close to the top five. Delhomme has also not shown too much this season either. Eli can't put together a solid full game yet (although you have to like him in pressure situations). I hate the Eagles with all my heart and soul but McNabb is the best QB in the league now, hands down. He is spreading the ball around, doesn't make stupid passes, can make things happen when the defensive line is closing in on him; he pretty much is dominating.

Also, Leinhert had a monster game last night and was in no way responsible for the collapse. It is way too soon to say how his career will end up, but right now, I think he can definately be put in the argument for a top ten QB in the league. He made some rookie mistakes (like almost throwing the interception) but it wasn't an interception and he did everything he needed to do to put his team in a position to win the game. These guys have to shut up about him blowing the lead - he didn't, special teams (Rackers and punt coverage) and Edge fumbling cost them the game).

Politics Blogger said...

Yeah, just like the media was too in love with the Bears, they're going overboard with Leinart. Sure, he "took what the defense gave him" and that's all fine and dandy, but he wasn't threading the needle downfield or anything. Even his TD passes resulted from missed tackles/slips by the Bears. Some more points for you sudden Bears haters...
1) BAD CALLS--No way you reverse the 1st Q interception with that video evidence. Roughing the kicker to keep alive the 2nd half AZ drive? Not calling interference or illegal contact on the pass to Berrian near the endzone.
2) BEARS' RUN D--When it counted, the Bears stopped Edge. If they don't stop them on 3 and 2, the Bears get stuck hoping Rackers misses from closer than 40. 40 shouldn't be hard for him, but it's not a gimme like a 25-yarder or something.
3) BEARS MADE THEIR OWN BREAKS--The last time I checked, Mark Anderson swiped at the ball when he creamed Leinart, and Brown was there to scoop it up. I also saw Brian Urlacher, when he could have been going through the motions, come into the play and strip James. It wasn't like the Cardinals dropped the ball--the Bears took it from them.

You'd think the Cardinals would learn how to become graceful losers with all the practice they've had. But now the Bears can go back to playing the "respect" card, so they shouldn't be taking off quarters and halves anymore.

Horatio said...

I said it before, I say it again.

The Bears frighten me on a personal level. They make me feel personally inadequate. I am not afraid to admit it...

Horatio said...

If Arizona is smart, they trade Rackers today. To highest bidder for any kicker. ANY. Dont keep him around, If I was Matt I would have punched him out after the game.

Unknown said...

Well, NDYanks...those are MY top 10 QBs.

Watching Big Ben play for 3 years at the alma mater and in games for the Steelers...he's not just a 'management' QB.
Underrate him if you like, but he means more to his team than many give credit for. So I'll rate him as such.

I'll admit though, when trying to think of the best QBs..I could only even name 15-17 QBs in the league.

Anonymous said...


that's funny, I said the same thing here about an hour previous

Anonymous said...

as for everyone bitching about the fantasy comments, send me your home address and I'll ship you off a big bag of cry.

I don't give a shit about dancing with the stars, the NBA, NHL or who britney is driving over with her car this week. I muddle through and so can you!

TJ said...

He looked shakey under pressure and did not do much in the second half when the Bears D decided they had better start playing.

Except when he drove them down into field goal range in the final minute. The kicker makes it and we're talking about how Lienart's clutchness saved the day.

Chris said...

Come on, NDYanksfan05. Enough with the "Roethlisberger is just a manage the game" type of QB garbage. Have you ever watched a Steelers game? Last year he lead them to an end of game drive on the road (@ San Diego) and also did so the year before (@ Jacksonville) against quality defenses to win the game. Not to mention in all three playoff games on the road they came out throwing (especially @ Indy & @ Denver) to get the lead so they could run the ball. He had 2 first half touchdowns @ Indy and 3 @ Denver to get the game under control. Heck, just Sunday he had a 47 yard TD to Washington. To say all he does is manage the game and throw short passes and his receivers take it from there is ridiculous. He is, I believe, 28-7 as a starter and that isn't all being done by handing off and letting his team play defense (although the Steelers do have a very good running games and defense). You don't have his success by accident. You have to be a very good QB and do what is asked of you. So, the bottom line is, under-rate him if you like but the body of work Roethlisberger has put together proves that your opinion isn't based on facts.

Hox said...

1) In my league, Rex Grossman scored a whopping -36 points, since they penalize severely for lost fumbles. And yes, I had him...
2) Any Colts fan attest that the only reason Edgerrin was successful in Indy was due to Indy's O-line. And yes, there have been times he lost games in Indy due to his butter fingers, which is exactly what happened here. Have fun earning your extra $2 million with a 1-5 team, Edge!
3) Tony has a lot of chemistry with Wilbon on PTI, which is why I don't watch when only Tony or only Mike are on the show. I agree though that he's flat on MNF.

Anonymous said...


not a lot of kicker trades flying around the NFL.

ndyanks, "Leinart" and "definitely". sometimes your posts make my eyes bleed.

Say what you want about Ben, but he's got a ring that most of the "better" QB's in the league don't have, and he's younger than most of "them"

ndyanksfan05 said...

If you'd like facts look at his passer rating this year - its pretty solid.

ndyanksfan05 said...

Why is that people posting on blogs are such pussies about spelling - its an internet blog not a damn english paper. Cry me a river.

Anonymous said...



how you guys can spell Roethlisberger and not Leinart is beyond me.

Anonymous said...

ndyanks, thanks for showing us what a supposed ND education does for your writing skills, not to mention the formulation of an argument.

30k a year to go there? WURTH EVERAY PENNEE

Anonymous said...

if it was an english paper I would point out to you that you should have said "it's an internet blog..." not "its".

ndyanksfan05 said...

Yup - you got it. Obviously my spelling when churning out a thirty second blog post during minute long breaks during work is a reflection on my education. Just because you a super-sensitive douchebag who has nothing better to do with his time then peruse others postings for spelling errors and gramatical mistakes, doesn't mean that anyone else cares if someone makes an unnoticable mistake when typing. If you cant get the gist of Leinhert vs. Leinart than you are a bigger idiot than most, you tool.

Chris said...

Dan, I wish I had a direct line to you while the game was going on last night. You are the guy who has constantly bashed Leinart (along with JJ Redick and Brett Farve) for 2 solid years and taken every shot at him you could (from him being over-hyped, to Paris Hilton, to his out-of-wedlock child). Well, if last night is any indication of his future (and instant history mandates that it is) you are again looking very bad. Leinart, with his backround and college preparation looks to be the real deal. Alot more so than Grossman who according to a comment made my Steve Young after the game, "played the worst game I've ever seen a QB play". Oh wait, he is a Gator though so I'm sure it wasn't his fault or an aberration. I've said it all year and I'll say it here now. The Bears defense, as great as it is, isn't good enough to overcome having ex-Gator Grossman under center. In the end, they aren't winning squat. He must have looked in a mirror last night and remembered he went to Florida, and as with all Florida QBs, he doesn't have the goods to get the Bears to the pinnacle. You don't think playoff defenses will stack the line against the run and force Wuerrful,errrrr, Grossman to beat them? Yeah, me too. Do you really think based on that awful performace against a bad defense last night that he can? Yeah, me neither. By the way, Leinart deserves a ton of credit because he had a game like that against the #1 rated defense in the NFL. He didn't make mistakes and managed the game against a great D. Could Grossman do the same against a bad D? Uh, no, to the tune of 4 ints and 2 fumbles.

I guess the point of all this, is that when you bash guys without much reason, you look bad when they prove to be more than your bias would allow youto believe. And just because a guy went to Florida (and don't even get me started on that absurd post of yours about the Gators frontline being the best in college basketball in the last 25 years, that is just delusional) doesn't mean he is great. By the way, didn't you go to Northwestern?

The MQ and DQ were always great and I posted frequently on the MQ. I've tried to follow your blog when I could because I enjoyed the MQ so much, but as someone else said this blog is turning into a Florida home page and more difficult to read every day.

nyc-steelers fan said...

I don't watch pardon, just not my thing. Apparently kornheiser is pretty good on it; hell, it got him the MNF gig. And I know he has a lot of fans from it. I heard the hype about Tony coming into this year, and I wanted him to be good, because I absolutely hated the ESPN booth team of the past few years. So not being a huge Tony fan, I'd say I'm pretty objective, not judging him on his PTI performance. And I didn't think it could get any worse, but as I have said before, TK's performance has had me pining for the days that Joe and Paul used to forget that there was a football game going on.

I do hope he either gets a hell of a lot better, or decides to hang it up and go back to the gig where his personality is better suited.

Gary said...

Tony Kornheiser plays off arguing with someone, Joe Theisman doesn't argue, he basically stares into space after Tony says something, that's why he's unable to be "himself" on MNF.

He either needs to adapt to this, or ESPN needs to find a replacement

Chris said...

Roethlisberger's passer rating this year is bad (and I'm not going to make any excuses about his motorcycle accident or appendectomy as many have because when you step on the field there are no excuses) but he looked better on Sunday and I'm willing to bet, that based on his previous body of work, that by the end of the year it will be very solid.

By the way, I meant to said it on an earlier post but didn't, Urlacher is an absolute beast. He was everywhere in the second half last night and seemingly willed that defense to get back in the game. He is as good as it gets at the LB position right now. (And I'm not a Bears fan at all).

Brave Sir Robin said...

Two things here:

First, NDYanks fan, congratulations. If that ND stands for Notre Dame (and I can't imagine it stands for anything else), you have officially broken the asshole meter. Can you possibly root for more arrogant, shitty, overrated, and evil teams?

Second, that said, ShittyTeamFan is right about Big Ben. All of you who are arguing against him with this "He won a Super Bowl" nonsense are wrong. How can I say that? Trent Dilfer.

No, don't try to argue, don't try to rationalize, just shut up. If Trent Dilfer can win a Super Bowl, anyone can do it in the right set of circumstances. Big Ben's came last year when the Steelers cheap shotted Palmer's knee, got lucky because the Colts eat a dick and the safety decided to trip over Big Ben instead of running that ball all the way back, and THEN they play a Seahawks team, which SUCKS, in the worst Super Bowl I have seen.

The whole Big Ben accident/appendix crap is all karmic payback for his luck last year. And don't think he's back just because he could make throws to wide open receivers against the Chiefs. Mark my words, he is now officially the Vince Carter of the NFL, minus the talent. One hard hit, and he'll be tossing picks left and right.

Brave Sir Robin said...

P.S. ShittyTeamFan, your posts do have a lot of noticeable grammatical problems. Not saying they belittle your point (your name does that on its own), but accusing people of not having a life because they have elementary grammatical skills is pretty idiotic considering that you like the Yankees and the Racists.

Jake C said...

How about this one for you all...Vick called the Giants defense "pretty vanilla" and "pretty basic." Mind you, the Giants sacked him seven times and forced him to fumble four times. Uh, either accept the loss (beatdown) like a man, or if that really is true, what does that say about you?

Steve said...

I think when you have 19 fantasy football teams and you are calling a Chicago Bears QB "Sexy Rexy" it might be time to look at what direction your life is headed in.

ndyanksfan05 said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Unknown said...

Hey Dan-

Don't forget that the 6th man of that team was also a Jew.

as far as greatt QBs go...

Id say this: after that game and the display Leinart put on I'll make a list of the QBs that are DEFFINITLY better than him

Brady, Peyton, McNabb, Palmer, Brees, Bulger, Vick (complete package), my Del-Homey, Hasselback

on the fence: leftwich and rivers (not enough info yet)

fell off the fence into a bottomless pit: favre

still, that's oly 9 QBs that are deffinitly better and that's VERY impressive

Cody said...

Troy - In the final minute would have been impressive, but he actually had 2:53 to work with. In that time he drove them 39 yards (again he had a short field) with a 5 yd dink here and a 6 yd dunk there. I realize that he was just taking what the D was giving him.

I wasn't saying that Leinart didn't do a decent job in only his second start (He and Edge definitely need a better O-line) but I'm not going to sing praises of his super stellar performance and put him in my top 10 QBs either.

FreKy J said...

for once I'm with maher.

On the forums of the MMO computer games, there's a specific phrase that is referenced when people cry about their lame woes (in this case Fantasy Leages).

Cry More Noob.

Kurt said...

"Hey KURT, guess what?

- Dan Mega

Hey Dan, it doesn't bother me, I'm a Giants fan not a Cardinals fan. It's just a shame that the Bears got that lucky in a game they deserved to lose. Play that 4th quarter 10 more times, the Bears lose probably 9-10 of them. And no, there will be no asterik in the record books next to that Bears win, it just goes to show that if a shitty Cardinals team can beat them, so can anyone else (except the Raiders).

Dan Shanoff said...

Hey Chris --

Look, what did I just do? 'Fessed up to being completely wrong about Leinart. What more can I do? If I still wrote on ESPN.com, I'd write it there. I could set up a Leinart worship page, but I think that me acknowledging that I was wrong about him is pretty fair.

As to the complaint that I'm Florida-biased? Well, it IS football season and the team is/was in the BCS hunt (and, the last two weeks, involved in the top national game of the week), so it's hardly crazy that I discussed them.

And if you saw on Sunday morning, rather than doing some obsessive breakdown of the Florida-Auburn game, I actually (a) was quick to point out that the ref's call on Leak's fumble was the right call, and (b) spent the bulk of the wordcount writing about why college football's system still sort of rules.

(Yes, I had Florida listed at No. 7 in my latest rankings, but it was listed without further comment about them.)

I know I'm coming across as defensive about this, but I think that if you look at the proverbial "body of work" the last six weeks, you'll see that this is hardly some Florida fan site.

(Not that there's anything wrong with being a Florida fan site.)

The comments on this post alone should confirm that. We're headed toward the most commented-on post in the short history of this blog. I think that's pretty cool, especially because the comment quality is so high on this.

Dan Shanoff said...
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Dan Shanoff said...
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Mega said...

Kurt- I agree with you. "Any Given Sunday" (or Monday) has been proven over and over again.
So what if they got a little lucky? Those 2 fumbles were forced my friend, by a very talented defense. Should be fun to watch them and the G-Men go at it.

Jake C said:
"as much as even I like him and think he can be a good/solid QB - I would NEVER trust my fantasies to him."

Shanoff, would you consider this Funniest. Unintentional. Joke. Ever.?

FreKy J said...

Dan's the newest member of the Department of Redundancy Department.

Might wanna nix 2 of those 3 repeat posts.

Anonymous said...

stay classy golden domer.

Chris said...

To your credit you did say you were wrong about Leinart. I should have mentioned that in my post. I feel you are a talented writer and the MQ was a great idea as a way to give fans across the country a chance to react "instantly" to games/events. It's also okay to like Florida and post about them. We all have favorite teams or players. I just think that sometimes you can go overboard and could be a little more objective. Posting about Florida football the past 2 weeks (as you pointed out they were in 2 very high profile games) is fine but saying things like "Tebow for Heisman" and Florida's frontline is the best in college hoops in the past 25 years based on 1 national title is a little over the top and strains your credibility. Hey, I have my own biased opinions (see my defense of Roethlisberger as a Steeler fan on this page) and am guilty as the next guy I suppose. Everyone has an opinion and the expression of those thoughts on pages like these is a great outlet. I was just trying (in my own smarmy, smart-ass way, that my wife points out correctly, I use to often) to point out that you shouldn't let your Gator colored glasses distort your view of the sports landscape so often. No harm meant and your reply had some very good points.

Dan Shanoff said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Dan Shanoff said...

Well, that last post was not by me. Please only post comments under your own preferred Commenter pseudonym... uh, not mine. You're already given the freedom to post virtually anonymously -- why rip me off?

FreKy J said...

Hey Dan. Just an idea, since this seems to be the hottest comment topic right now..

You should make an introductory post, so that everyone who wants to introduce themselves to everyone else that posts here can do so.

Seeing Chris' most recent post makes me want to go "Hi I'm blah blah and this is where my allegiances lie."

paul said...

Wow, no windsocks here, no sir.

Within the first few posts we get a guy dismissing the Bears dominant 5 games in favor of their miracle 1, and declaring them "not for real", and more comparable to the '01 Bears than the '85 Bears.

Whereas, presumably, had the Bears simply LOST the Monday Night game by 14, then won the rest of their games convincingly, they'd still be comparable to the '85 team. Right? That makes a lot of sense. So because the Bears WIN the game, but do it in miraculous fashion, they're penalized and compared to a fluke team from '01. Never mind the dominance displayed in their other games, or that this was by far the worst they'll play all year.

Then we get someone putting Leinart among the top NFL QBs. Oh really? Leinart who is 0-2, and whose offense scored a measly 10 points last night on its own strength? Those are hall of fame numbers? The guy got 13 points off of SIX turnovers. That's not good. Did he look poised? Sure. Maybe he should learn to keep up the intensity of his first couple drives for a whole game, and he might actually WIN one.

But yea, I don't bury a dominant 6-0 team because they win a game they should have lost. And I don't canonize a QB who's 0-2 and disappears after the first quarter.

Also, bad as Rex was, his SIX turnovers, on the worst night of his life, cost the Bears 13 points. Leinart's one turnover, on the best night of his life, cost the Cardinals 7.

The Bears will keep winning, with or without the support of the online (and ESPN) windsocks.

Dan Shanoff said...
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Jo Fer said...

Just my two cents about last night.

Absolutely unbelievable.

I'm a bears fan out here in AZ that went to the game last night. The crowd (75% Card fans, 25% Bears fans) did not sit for the ENTIRE game. It was that level of energy in that place. And then the way Cardinals imploded.....I had to leave with my head down. Felt like I went twelve rounds with a boxer that beat the crap out of me and then I kicked him in the nuts for the KO and the ref didn't see it.

Any texas hold'em champ will tell you they had one really amazing 'suck out' that got them the championship.... If the bears do go on to win it all and maybe do it undefeated... this is was their 'suck out'.

Chris said...


I didn't think you were completely serious about the "Tebow for Heisman" stuff although your comment about the Gators frontline came with comments to back it up so I think you were perhaps more serious about that. Either way, I may have missed your attempt at humor. If so, that is my fault. The last post I made was an attempt by me to see your point of view and acknowledge the biases' that we all have when it comes to sports and I thought was conciliatory in nature. It was meant as nothing more than constructive criticism from a fan as opposed to someone who actually has any training in journalism.

Richard said...

Yes Leinart may very well be one of the top 10 QB's in the league. I'd say he's easily in the top half right now. This is partially true due to how bad the NFL QB's are:

Vick - Shaub was considered untradeable.
Plummer - Broncos traded up for Cutler.
Leftwich - JAX fans seem to want Gerrard
Bledsoe - Dallas fans want Romo
Pennington - Jets drafted Clemens and traded for Ramsey
Carr - well, maybe if the line could block

And that's not even starting to mention the QB's that just plain suck.

Bottom line is, other than Brady, Manning x 2, Delhomme, Palmer, McNabb, Hassselbeck, Bulger, Roethlisberger and Brees, where are the franchise QB's? And Brees was let go while Roethlisberger had fans wanting Batch the last few weeks.

Chris said...


Top 20 in the past 25 years? Of course they are. Probaly in the Top 10 or possible Top 5 based on what they do this year. I agree with you that UNC can't be pre-season #1 it has to be Florida based on what they did last year and who returns. I don't think they will repeat though. That magic is tough to re-capture (just ask the Steelers).

I am a Penn State grad so if you have to jump on a new bandwagon that your wife doesn't pick for you, then go with someone original like Boise State as opposed to a rival Big 10 school. Besides after seeing Michigan on Saturday night I think they beat Ohio State.

Shums said...

Three thoughts about Cards/Bears:

1. Kornheiser bashing Theismann every chance he got, pointing out his ridiculous inconsistencies, making fun of him... that's comic gold. I laughed every time they had a conversation, especially imagining Tirico sitting there awkwardly listening to his producer screaming in his ear "CUT THEM OFF! CHANGE THE SUBJECT! DO SOMETHING, IDIOT!!!" I dunno why you guys want Tony out -- as long as Theismann is there, that combo is worth five or six laughs a game.

2. Did Denny Green channel Marty Schottenheimer in the second half? Are we sure Marty wasn't calling in the plays from the press box or something? Can anyone confirm this? (Except for that post-game outburst. That was all Denny Green. Shades of the Vikings years. Good times.)

3. This game was the most obvious example of the difference that a winning mentality makes in sports. The Bears have it. The Cardinals do not, except for Leinart. When the chips were down, you could actually SEE the players on both teams who had the right attitude (Urlacher, Anderson, Leinart) and those who didn't (Edge, Grossman, even Rackers). I've never seen a game where that was so visibly definable. Having said that, Leinart's attitude will eventually spread to the rest of the Cards. They really are on their way. Just not going to happen overnight is all.

Dan Shanoff said...
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Dan Shanoff said...

Again, someone has spent the last few posts posing as me. I'm not quite sure why they feel the need to do it, but where you see "Comment deleted," that's me taking out the offending post. Or, I've deleted it permanently, so you can't even see that I've deleted it. It's just gone.

Whoever you are: PLEASE stop posting as me. If you have something you want to say, do it under your own name. Thank you.

-- D.S.

Unknown said...

Of the new QBs (within 4 years)..Big Ben gets to the Hall first.

Dan Shanoff said...

The funniest thing about this dude posting as me and continually referencing "CNNSI.com" is that (a) it's not even called CNNSI.com (it's SI.com), and (b) doesn't the guy know that I *worked* at CNNSI.com as a columnist and editor?

(I edited Peter King's MMQB column and Dr. Z's various rankings and mailbags, plus wrote my own stuff, most notably the "Dance at a Glance" columns about the 1999 NCAA Tournament, which was one of the best series of columns I ever wrote. Ah well...)

Dan Shanoff said...

By the way, anyone have any ideas about how I should deal with this, beyond the draconian measure of turning off the ability of readers to comment (which I REALLY don't want to do)?

Here's one idea: I'll simply stop commenting in this comment area. Then you'll know that ANY comments made by "Dan Shanoff" are by this guy(s) who is faking that he's me. Then, everyone can simply ignore what they are saying.


Christian Thoma said...

Dan, keep posting. We'll just check the profile to make sure it's you (that's what I do).

Hmm, I call it CNNSI. I didn't realize that was wrong. I beg forgiveness.

Hende said...

The reader will just have to confirm you're the real deal. If they click on the name for the real 'dan shanoff', the link goes to:


which also has a link back to your blog's front page.

Keep posting, and put the onus on the readers to confirm who you are.

Brian in Oxford said...


You mentioned switching to a different blog software, when I met you at the VL gig earlier this month. Short of that, does blogger have a way to block specific user IDs from posting? That way, you could trace the ID to the bogus posts, and simply make it ineligible to post.

Is there a way to allow "registered" comments? Either that, or charge us all $10 for the right to comment. Blech.

Kurt said...

"By the way, anyone have any ideas about how I should deal with this, beyond the draconian measure of turning off the ability of readers to comment (which I REALLY don't want to do)?"-Dan Shanoff

Dan, don't stop posting on the comment page, that's what keeps people on your blog, because they like the fact that you may respond to their comments.

Whoever is doing it is getting a kick out of the fact that you are getting so worked up about it. Just delete the guys posts and ignore him and eventually he will get bored and realize he's being a doochebag and stop.

Other than that I'm not familiar with blogger.com's tools to identify the blog administrator when posting on his/her own comment section. Maybe if it doesnt exist we could suggest the feature to them, so your posts show up in a different color or something.

Jo Fer said...


Many have beat me to it, but that's what I've been doing, (check the profile)

They are almost becoming so obvious that I can usually dismiss them as the fake just by their comments.

Christian Thoma said...

So are we hearing any rumors leading up to the trade deadline? Moss?

danshanoffimposter said...

Hey guys,

I put an end to the fake dan shanoff problem.

1) The old Dan Shanoff was me
2) I opened Microsoft Word and wrote a bunch of characters and copied this to the clipboard
3) Went to the change email and changed this so I could never get a new password
4) I pasted the password I don't know
5) I saved it

Dan I am sorry for the whole fiasco. It was a dumb practical joke. I know I had said many times that I would stop but I persisted to use it. Now I have locked myself out of it and I had changed the email in there

My point: CONSIDER IT HISTORY. I love your blog. I'm just an immature idiot who was bored

Jen said...

Boy this thread is full of hilarities! Not only is everyone arguing about QBs, but spelling errors and fake Dans!
Love it!

Curtis (Indy) said...

I had Grossman, up 20 points and he got me -12.5, so you're thinking wow got away with that one right...well maybe not my opponent had the Bears defense. So they got him just enough to get the exact point total for what I had going into the game. So if I sit Grossman and don't play anyone at QB (nevermind pick up Leinhart and play him) then I would have tied.

Generik said...

I have yet to sit through an entire MNF game this season, but what I have seen of Tony Kornheiser I have liked more often then not. He definitely does like to take jabs at Theisman,. I remember the first MNF game this year he made some comment about Theismans hair not being real.. just hilarious and Theisman couldn't figure out anything to say to respond and instead stammered like an idiot for 5 seconds.

If anything, I think Theisman should go.. that dude is way to dry in the booth. I would love someone who was a little more lively that could banter back with Tony. Hell, get Wilbon up there ;-)

Chris said...

I love how Roethlisberger has a bunch of shitty games, and then one good game this week and he's "great" (again).

Grossman has a bunch of good/great games, followed by one shitty one and now he is "terrible".

It was just one week people, let's not throw away what we've seen from the rest of the season on either of these guys, ok?

paul said...

"This game was the most obvious example of the difference that a winning mentality makes in sports. The Bears have it. The Cardinals do not, except for Leinart. When the chips were down, you could actually SEE the players on both teams who had the right attitude (Urlacher, Anderson, Leinart) and those who didn't (Edge, Grossman, even Rackers). I've never seen a game where that was so visibly definable. Having said that, Leinart's attitude will eventually spread to the rest of the Cards."

This post has the right idea but becomes nonsense in the details. Grossman played like garbage, but how can you say he didn't have a winning attitude, or seemed down on himself, or indulged in fatalism or anything like that? He had nothing going on and he CONTINUED to heave it deep downfield and make big play attempts. Now, he shouldn't have been allowed to do that, considering how bad a game he was having. It was Ron Turner's fault for that. But Grossman showed as much a winning mentality as anyone can have in that spot, in my opinion. I'm not sure what else you expected him to do considering how badly he was playing. He kept trying, he kept positive on the sidelines, and he was positive in post-game interviews. Hence, his teammates still believe in him, and he'll continue to have a great year. This was a bump in the road.

As for Leinart, I think his hype is ridiculous right now. This guy has scored 28 points on 4 TD passes in two first quarters, and NOTHING afterward, in two games. Those plays were SCRIPTED. Once he's been off the script, he's died. He's been decidedly mediocre. Not bad, but not a winning QB or anything close to one. Sort of a young Brad Johnson. The guy doesn't have some magic winning attitude. He's now 0-2 as an NFL starting QB, and both losses were BAD losses, in that his team should have won, but he disappeared in the last 3 quarters. Right now, give me Vince Young. He did the same thing Leinart did against the Bears, against the Colts, ON THE ROAD (Leinart and Co would have lost by 40 to the Bears in Chi), and then went out the next week and got a win. And this with much less talent around him.

Shums said...


I get what you're saying. I just made my comment based on what I saw in the faces and performances of Grossman and Leinart. Grossman did not look confident in himself. He never looked, to me, like he was confident that his team would win the game. He did not look like he had the confidence of his team. In my opinion, he looked like a beaten football player. And that was reflected in his play.

I'm not saying he didn't do all he could. I'm not saying he "indulged in fatalism" -- not sure where you got that one. I'm just saying, from my observations, he did not look like he believed he could bring his team back.

Leinart, on the other hand, looked supremely confident. Though he did not play as well in the second half, he did lead the potential winning drive and put his team in a position to hold on and win. I think that confidence will affect the Cardinals later on. Your points about the scripted plays are very valid, though.

My comment wasn't meant to be a categorical criticism of Grossman or Leinart. One game doesn't make a huge difference either way. But on this one day, this one time, I saw one confident quarterback and one very unconfident one.